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American Bulldog/Greyhound cross
 
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
These dogs are just amazing![br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083369_19198_FT0_abghhead.jpg][img:width=500&height=333]{e_FILE}public/1327083369_19198_FT0_abghhead_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083369_19198_FT0_abgh.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083369_19198_FT0_abgh_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083369_19198_FT0_abgh2.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083369_19198_FT0_abgh2_.jpg">[/link][br]
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
These ones are called Alaunts:[br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt2.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt2_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt3.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt3_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt4.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt4_.jpg">[/link][br]
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Only the top one looks like a legit ambull/grey to me. Are you sure the others are? The second one just looks like a young athletic ambull, and the 3rd looks like an alaunt. Some ambull/greys
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Yeah I labeled the 3rd one wrong, it is an Alaunt named Zeus, but the second one, look at the length of the back and the high waist. Got it off huntinglife. Are sure those are Ambull/Greys and not Bully Greys? The heads are a lot smaller than the first pic.
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Definitely not bullygreys, I'm not sure if they're 50/50 ambull/grey though, they were labelled as ambull/grey so I'm sure they're mostly that but heard from someone else they might have a little boxer in them. People can get lazy explaining all the fine details behind a breeding sometimes. Still anyway I don't think the smaller heads show they're not ambull/greys, the cross could turn out any number of ways. Which I guess explains that second dog you posted as well, I like it a lot and I suppose I've seen some bullygreys that build so fair enough.
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I'm really impressed by them. Do you know what is in the Alaunt?
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
The new alaunt was created by crossing bull mastiffs, bull terriers, and greyhounds.
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Thanks Gamebred.
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327122733=Tonedog] Definitely not bullygreys, I'm not sure if they're 50/50 ambull/grey though, they were labelled as ambull/grey so I'm sure they're mostly that but heard from someone else they might have a little boxer in them. People can get lazy explaining all the fine details behind a breeding sometimes. Still anyway I don't think the smaller heads show they're not ambull/greys, the cross could turn out any number of ways. Which I guess explains that second dog you posted as well, I like it a lot and I suppose I've seen some bullygreys that build so fair enough. [/quote1327122733] why the boxer? from what i hear on this forum the boxer sucks.
Quote · 974 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327122761=KeyserSoze] These ones are called Alaunts:[br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt2.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt2_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt3.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt3_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt4.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327083619_19198_FT85870_alaunt4_.jpg">[/link][br] [/quote1327122761] i like the last one the most
Quote · 973 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
They kind of look like the australian BullArab dogs they use for hunting wild pigs n boars.
Quote · 973 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327194521=cawkazn] [quote1327122733=Tonedog] Definitely not bullygreys, I'm not sure if they're 50/50 ambull/grey though, they were labelled as ambull/grey so I'm sure they're mostly that but heard from someone else they might have a little boxer in them. People can get lazy explaining all the fine details behind a breeding sometimes. Still anyway I don't think the smaller heads show they're not ambull/greys, the cross could turn out any number of ways. Which I guess explains that second dog you posted as well, I like it a lot and I suppose I've seen some bullygreys that build so fair enough. [/quote1327122733] why the boxer? from what i hear on this forum the boxer sucks. [/quote1327194521] They do suck, like every other purebreed in history, hence why the hybridisation is being done. However, like a lot of purebreeds, they have some good qualities they can offer a cross. If you're breeding ambull/greyhounds and you're finding they're either throwing too much like the ambull and too slow, or too much like the greyhound and not sturdy and durable enough, introducing some boxer makes a whole lot of sense because it's a very athletic and fast bullbreed. In pure form it does indeed suck because it's muzzle is deformed and weak, this is quickly corrected with a cross to just about anything though. A boxer x collie for example would have a way stronger jaw than both parent breeds combined, just getting that bit of length quickly corrects the boxers muzzle and you end up with a dog that can bite like a pitbull because the boxer is supposed to be a bullbreed, it still has that heritage in it's genes and it quickly reverts back to a strong gripping dog with a simple corrective cross. So yeah it's crappy muzzle and jaw is really not a big deal to be concerned about. The heart issues with boxers would be a bigger concern, but maybe not to serious boardoggers who aren't expecting their dogs to live into old age, and it's going to be significantly reduced in such healthy hybrids anyway. Boxers as a breed are in disarray but it's logically flawed to think this means mutts with boxer influence are in any way impaired, easily demonstrated as definitely false with so many excellent working boxer crosses around. Working hybrids comprised of crap breeds aren't crap, it just doesn't work that way.
Quote · 973 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
hybrid vigor! i can dig it
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Yeah I think the boxer is probably the most intelligent bull breed, I just think it is too leggy and I don't Brachycephaly.
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Well I disagree it's too leggy, but yeah their heads are crap. And good point about their intelligence, their temperament in general is pretty great, maybe a little infantile at times but they're enthusiastic to work, smart and typically pretty brave and rough.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Well too leggy because their heads are so small lol but yeah if they had bigger heads like some of the German Boxers I've seen they would look right. [youtube]SyBvlAi-kdM[/youtube]
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
At 1:04 with the T-shirt and also at 1:34 with the shallow grip on the sleeve...you can see the problem with the short muzzle of the boxer. The AB x greyhound seems like a good cross to me. Another good cross IMO worth considering would be AB x Great Dane. I've seen a few APBT x Great Danes and they are rather nice. Making dogs like this is easy as far as F1s are concerned, but it takes a lot of time to perfect these types of breedings long term.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I think the Great Dane just makes a dog slower unless of course it was a bit lighter which would again mean adding Greyhound. I have always thought a Greyhound/Great Dane may produce a faster dog if the proportions were right which pretty much is what the Roo Dog is with the harder Irish Wolfhound instead.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Kangaroo Dog[br][link={e_FILE}public/1327252227_19198_FT85870_roodog.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1327252227_19198_FT85870_roodog_.jpg">[/link][br] I think a Roo Dog/American Bully cross like Rambo would be just about perfect for a calm house dog.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I always like to imagine what type of dog I would have if I were to mix him with a great dane.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I have never been impressed with the Great Dane/Pitbulls, sorry Midgard, but they just seem to flatten out and look like a big hound dog. [youtube]FTWb0OwEGNg[/youtube] [youtube]EHwqLSsHsC0[/youtube] To take advantage of the Great Dane's build it really needs less mass and lower body fat which could only come from the sight hounds. IMO Great Dane's are more sight hound than mastiff to me.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
That post has nothing to do with Midgard's program. You can find good specimens to represent the idea...or you can find junk. One does not represent the other.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
i think the great dane x mastiff vs the greyhound x mastiff the greyhound mix will leave you with a lighter more muscular agile dog the great dane mix will leave you with a dog not as muscular, a little slower, but more thicker, not such a think build etc. i think a bandogge with the great dane influence brings you something more similar to the aluant to mix rambo with a great dane i think would produce a dog much more bandogge like..... not as thick, a little more leg, and not so low to the ground. I must admit I am a fan of the great dane though.
Quote · 972 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
look at these danes [br][img:width=360&height=325]{e_FILE}public/1327288198_18975_FT85870_cayneux7l.jpg">[br][img:width=454&height=360]{e_FILE}public/1327288198_18975_FT85870_deutschedogge1.jpg">[br][link={e_FILE}public/1327288198_18975_FT85870_ares13.jpg][img:width=500&height=581]{e_FILE}public/1327288198_18975_FT85870_ares13_.jpg">[/link][br]
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
@KeyserSoze No problem
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I think that a Scott American bulldogXDane would be a great mix.
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http://maclainkennels.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/domino.jpg
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See those Danes I think would only be improved upon with Greyhound or Roo Dog. The APBT just makes them shorter and flatter with even the best specimens.
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KeyserSoze, I don't know what you actual experience is with APBT x Great Dane FIRST HAND...and while you are correct in SOME OF THEM would not be impressive...I can attest PERSONALLY that the APBT x GD can indeed make a phenomenal dog. If you think "even the best of specimens" of APBT x GD makes a flatter dog...well...I would say you really lack experience with such dogs...as that simply isn't true. In fact, I would venture to say on average, the cross seems to work almost naturally...with a high frequency of producing excellent working dogs in terms of drive and physical ability.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327357131=Gamebred] http://maclainkennels.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/domino.jpg [/quote1327357131] This looks better than any Great Dane/APBT cross I have seen, again IMO.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
That dog has been used in David Ishi's (Midgard Mastiffs) program. This dog here, Black Jack, was lacking in terms of substance/durability as far as I am concerned...in terms of bone or mass...and I ended up getting rid of all the GD blood bred dogs we had...but in no way were these dogs "flat." In fact, they were VERY HIGH STRUNG dogs...with loads of energy and drive. I actually think if one made sure to select for solid nerves (which can be a problem with some GD dogs), they would have been phenomenal sport type "PP" dogs due to their tremendous energy, agility, and drive. Black Jack... Here is another GD x APBT that I worked. OLD PHOTO when we had crappy digital cameras. The dog's name was Ike. He too was a phenomenal dog in terms of drive and ability, and this dog is back in the pedigree of some of the Midgard dogs. Sorry about the crappy photo. You can't see how big this dog actually was here. Although not a giant by any means, he was a ripped dog and he was around 95-100# lean. This dog had more muscle and substance than did Black Jack. Ike really looked like a giant pit, but you can't tell that in this photo. Here, he seems to kind of look like a black boxer or something with a pronounced stop...but being I knew this dog in real life I can assure you that must be due to crappy lighting or something...as the dog really didn't have much stop at all...and looked more like an oversize APBT with just more leg. He had a thick rear quarter too. I recall this dog being able to jump over a dog house that was 4x4x4 box frame that sat on top of cinder blocks...making it nearly 5' tall...and the dog would run helicopters around a chain spot...clearing the dog house each round. Anyone that knew Ike knew he was definitely not a low key or "flat" dog.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I think dane x apbt can make fine animals indeed, I don't really know what flat means, but the apbt x danes I've seen gave me the impression of a "fixed" dane, what a dane should really be like to excel at it's role as a boarhound. I do however wonder how consistently such a cross could throw dogs that are in any way protective, since neither breed is commonly protective and even decidedly non-protective. Both of them.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
They are not bad looking but like you said they look like a giant pit and I just think that is not an improvement over the smaller pits. At 100 lbs I think a leggy American Bully like Rambo is better. The only cross with a pit that makes sense to me is with a smarter dog or a bigger head.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
That would depend upon the PURPOSE...and not be a blanket true statement. If the dog is expected to stop a man at the door and drive him backwards while getting hit across the skull...a dog like Rambo's boy would be better. If however, the dog is expected to pursue a man through a junk yard...over an agility course...or run down a hog over much distance...or grab a man at a distance ASAP...speed, agility, and stamina become more valuable. All that said, I too would much prefer a dog like Rambo's dog...but, that does not mean the APBT x GD dogs are less dogs. They are instead just different...and in the right arena or line of duty they would surpass many other dogs that have a more sturdy build.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
But you ended up getting rid of the Great Dane blood because it was lacking in substance, which is what I meant by flat, so you did not think they were best. For a tall dog I think the Great Pyrenees would be a perfect cross with a pit and actually be more like an Alaunt than the so called Alaunts of the UK. Rambo, Cawkazn's dog, I think would be as good if not better than a Rottweiler in agility and as good if not better than the AB Pro Catcher's on muzzle alone. [youtube]zdpRpapzxhU[/youtube] [youtube]_coi9YsQgps[/youtube] [youtube]aF05Z65s8io[/youtube]
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
NONE OF THOSE DOGS have the agility I have seen the APBT x GD deliver. Not one. They might move nice, but that is relative to their type. "Best" is also relative. Are APBT x GD better for MY DESIRES...nope. But that does NOT MEAN they are less dog that my dogs. It just means they are different than what I want. In fact, I would not say these dogs are less dogs than mine. I can appreciate a dog that is quality in some other area even if it is different than my desires. I keep a high degree of agility, heat tolerance and stamina in my dogs...but I balance power for MY desires. Not all applications need the same traits. Not all applications need the level of power that my dogs or that Rambo's dog would be capable of delivering. Some may want even more agility, heat tolerance, or stamina than I even desire...for applications may need a dog that can jump a 6-8 foot palisade...or that can run for 10 miles catching a boar on a hot day. I don't need that. I want a balance for man work. If however I wanted a man stopping size high agility type sport dog I think the APBT x GD would be VERY DIFFICULT to beat if you had representations like the dog Ike I referred to above. He had more durable construction than did Black Jack, but I wouldn't under-estimate Black Jack either when it comes to fighting a decoy on a sport field. Grease, speed, and some type of crack rock/crystal meth/PCP would have been a good way to describe him. LOL. When I said, they are not "flat," by flat, I couldn't help but think you meant not much life to them...for "alive" in my mind would be the opposite of flat...as in flat line...which would of course be dead. Semantics...but "flat" isn't really a "doggy term" so I was left to speculate what you meant. If however, you would like to clarify what you mean by flat, I would be open to reading that description should I have misunderstood your description.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Flat as in flat chested lol mass as you said. I do not agree that a Great Dane Pit is more agile than some American Bullys or American Bulldogs. Great Danes are known to be goofy and clumsy which is why we have Scooby Doo lol but seriously if I wanted an all out attack dog to leave alone in an enclosure then your dogs would be hard to beat but personally I prefer a dog for off leash protection I can have lay around the house and I just don't think your dogs would be best for that. I do love the Great Dane as much as everyone else here but I think it's calm and leggy attributes should be amplified by other calm breeds like the Greyhound or Bullmastiff or even the American Bulldog or American Bullys but not a gamedog. I think that if the Ishee's bred Domino and Psyche that would be just about perfect for me, although the other dogs seem to look like Fila crosses probably because of the Dane. Actually adding Fila to your Tosa/Gamedog line would just about max out the attack dog, maybe even some Boerboel. Hell just keep the hybrid vigor going round and round instead of trying to make a purebred dog may be more successful which I honestly am rooting for over the mainstream breeds. It would be nice to see an American Sentinel compete with Presa s. Corsos, Dogos, and Alaunts.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I was NOT referring to pure GD...but GD x APBT...and yes, they are way more agile than American Bullies and Am Bulldogs in that regard. Not even close. To say otherwise really illustrates that you have not seen the type of APBT x GD I have seen. No offense...but it isn't even a competition.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
If they are so great why aren't people using them to catch hogs or in agility competitions? Even the Aussies use Bullmastiff instead of APBT with Great Dane in their O'Halloran "Hounds" for pig hunts.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
I think my bully is pretty athletic, it's extremely fast and powerful. For obvious reasons I haven't been able to see it compete in speed with too many dogs but so far it has been faster, stronger and more agile than any of the ones he has been with. Then again he is not 14 inches tall weighing 100 pounds lol
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327375340=KeyserSoze] If they are so great why aren't people using them to catch hogs or in agility competitions? Even the Aussies use Bullmastiff instead of APBT with Great Dane in their O'Halloran "Hounds" for pig hunts. [/quote1327375340] Simple...if you are going to go with PURE agility...most people are going to stick with status quo rather than trying to recreate a working dog. I think they would make great catch dogs though.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327377370=Tonedog] I think dane x apbt can make fine animals indeed, I don't really know what flat means, but the apbt x danes I've seen gave me the impression of a "fixed" dane, what a dane should really be like to excel at it's role as a boarhound. I do however wonder how consistently such a cross could throw dogs that are in any way protective, since neither breed is commonly protective and even decidedly non-protective. Both of them. [/quote1327377370] yes!!! fix the danes! that is exactly my thoughts! the modern day dane is no good. its needs to be fixed with an outcross. and that dog should be the dane standard.
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[quote1327377494=KeyserSoze] [quote1327357131=Gamebred] http://maclainkennels.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/domino.jpg [/quote1327357131] This looks better than any Great Dane/APBT cross I have seen, again IMO. [/quote1327377494] what breeds were used to create this dog? i remember seeing him before and I made the statement he looks like a bully with legs, and someone said I was basically right? This is the direction bullies should go.
Quote · 971 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1327377795=KeyserSoze] But you ended up getting rid of the Great Dane blood because it was lacking in substance, which is what I meant by flat, so you did not think they were best. For a tall dog I think the Great Pyrenees would be a perfect cross with a pit and actually be more like an Alaunt than the so called Alaunts of the UK. Rambo, Cawkazn's dog, I think would be as good if not better than a Rottweiler in agility and as good if not better than the AB Pro Catcher's on muzzle alone. [youtube]zdpRpapzxhU[/youtube] [youtube]_coi9YsQgps[/youtube] [youtube]aF05Z65s8io[/youtube] [/quote1327377795] keyzer im glad you like my dogs man!
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@cawkazn The dog in the photo is half great dane half Scott American bulldog
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@KeyserSoze People use dane bullmastiff crosses for boar hunting because they are powerful and have good scenting ability.
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People use dane/bullmastiff for hunting boars in oz, and dane/apbts, and countless other variations. Apbts aren't exactly uncommon in australian boardogs but maybe avoided a little bit more than they would be because they're a banned controversial breed and boardoggers don't want any more on their plate than they already have to deal with from the anti-hunting crowd panning the magnifying glass over them and looking for something to whine about. The thing with breeding pig dogs is the work will shape the animals anyway, the breeds are important only in that you can't try and have a cocker spaniel provide the lugging ability in your cross. But using apbt or bull mastiff or ebt or whatever really doesn't matter, just a dog inclined to hold a grip and take punishment unphased in a melee with a boar, etc. They're just wanting to include that approach/technique/mentality in the dog they're producing, and it's the same quality regardless of which breed you extract it from. It's just a quality shared by a related family of breeds, so it really makes no difference where you get it from assuming the work will be there to refine the animal into a top quality performer. Goes for every other quality as well, the "breeds" used is really far from a significant concern.
Quote · 901 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1333403403=Tonedog] Only the top one looks like a legit ambull/grey to me. Are you sure the others are? The second one just looks like a young athletic ambull, and the 3rd looks like an alaunt. Some ambull/greys [/quote1333403403] Hey Tonedog do you still have that photo of the white EBTxGreys?
Quote · 901 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
Which one? I have a lot of photos of white ebt/greys.
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Thanks for getting back to me but I found your photobucket collection and it is quite the collection, hell it should be a gallery in itself here. btw it was the one with the 2 dogs and the left dog had a cut on it's back leg, they look like landsharks.
Quote · 900 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
[quote1333478946=Tonedog] Which one? I have a lot of photos of white ebt/greys. [/quote1333478946] Do you have the link to your top boar dogs list? I got a new computer and lost all my bookmarks.
Quote · 900 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
someone mentioned I should breed Domino (an Ambull x Dane f1) to Psyche. It's an interesting idea but I have a slightly different version of that breeding in mind. I bred Domino to Psyches mother Nyx I've got a male and a female from that breeding. The female is named Shakti and is about 11 months old now and about 27 inches at the shoulder and 95lbs. Shakti I'll be breeding her to Kronos, Psyche's sire. So instead of being: 50% Domino 25% Kronos 25% Nyx They will be: 50% Kronos 25% Domino 25% Nyx The reason I did the Domino x Nyx breeding is in response to what I got from the first Kronos x Nyx breeding. The 4 dogs I kept contact with were Thanatos (Tom) pictured at 12 months Boss pictured at 6 months Beulah not sure about her age in the picture Psyche pictured at 2 years They were all very well built dogs and very fast and agile. Tom who's about 120 has jumped a 6 ft pen. Over all I was very satisfied with the litter they all seemed to have great defense drive at were all very athletic. The only think they lacked to me was height (except Beulah she was about an inch taller than Kronos at 30 inches) and prey drive, like Nyx. Nyx is 26 inches at the shoulder. So I bred Nyx to Domino to produce an improved Nyx, I think I've done that in Shakti. So effectively I'll be repeating the Kronos x Nyx breeding but with enough Domino to bring up the prey and height. (Domino is about 30 inches maybe taller) If I get what I'm hoping for it should be an improved Kronos. Which is hard because Kronos is so close to what I want he sets a very high bar to surpass. Physically Psyche is the most Dane x game APBT of all my dogs. If I didn't know how she was bred I would have guessed DanexPit. I agree Danexpits can be fantastic athletes, they don't have enough substance for the kind of work I'm breeding for. That's why I feel they they are best bred to a more solid mastiff breed like a Neo. That's why I'll be breeding Psyche to Achilles my Neo, who surprisingly enough has great prey drive. He's an unusual Neo. I think Psyche and Achilles are capable of producing some very nice balanced working mastiffs. Achilles at 5 years old (29 inches and 150lbs) As for Dane crossed being "flat" or if I've got your meaning, thin. I agree, but I have a different view of a wide chested dog than most. I like a dog with a wide chest, but not from having a big gap between his shoulder joints. I like width of chest to come from well developed shoulder muscles, with the legs closer together than a mastiff or bulldog but farther than a sighthound, more like the proportions of a wolf, or a lot of the bully greys. Since I breed for bigger dogs I have mass without having to build the dog more "bulldogy" and I need the leaner build to keep them mobile at that size. That's my POV anyway. I think in a protection dog the Dane cross is a better choice, in a catchdog I'd go with the greyhound cross. You can find more solidly built and human aggressive danes (especially in European lines) than greyhounds, and they have a better head for bitework. Plus if your breeding for a protection bred, mobile mastiff the dane starts you closer to mastiff size than the greyhound, with a dane x game pit being in the 90 - 100 lbs range and a grey x pit in the 60 lbs range I'd guess. As a side point Nyx's mother's sire was another very impressive dog and Domino's half brother being Dane x Bordeaux. The result was very similar to Domino though maybe bigger. Their father the Dane had a reputation of being the most aggressively protective Dane any of the dog men in the area had ever seen by a large margin. Crossed to an Ambull and a Bordeaux the result was a very balanced mobile large dog with good drives, who were much more balanced and more capable than the parents.
Quote · 900 days ago · 0 people like this ·
 
wow I am just in love with Shakti and Boss, you've got mail.
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Thanks Keyser I like them a lot myself. I got your email.
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[quote1333570199=KeyserSoze] [quote1333478946=Tonedog] Which one? I have a lot of photos of white ebt/greys. [/quote1333478946] Do you have the link to your top boar dogs list? I got a new computer and lost all my bookmarks. [/quote1333570199] The site I wrote that on was taken off line, a while ago now, so I dunno. Didn't you copy and paste it here though? You could search your own posts. midguard [quote]Plus if your breeding for a protection bred, mobile mastiff the dane starts you closer to mastiff size than the greyhound, with a dane x game pit being in the 90 - 100 lbs range and a grey x pit in the 60 lbs range I'd guess.[/quote] Well actually bull/greyhounds are often around 100 lbs, sometimes considerably more. The photo keyser was asking about featured a male bully greyhound that weighed over 65 kgs or 145 lbs. It was admittedly a bit of a freak, but some lines average 100-110 lbs for the males. That said, they aren't "mastiffy" at all and also don't make good protection dogs. Incidentally the above dog could have been an exception, it was said to be aggressive towards strangers but this was seen as a flaw, also lacked the stamina of a good pig dog, for obvious reasons (all that muscle). The photo is popular (and I like it too) but the owner and breeder of the dogs doesn't consider the impressive one a good dog, the other little female was considered far superior.
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That's them, I did try searching first but can't seem to find it.
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If you can make a new list here you wont have to worry about losing it.
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True. I might make something slightly different, been thinking about outlining the different types that can contribute to a hybrid, what they potentially offer, both strengths and weaknesses, and then the top 5 breeds from each of these groups. I appreciate the interest anyway.
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what are we trying to accomplish with this particular cross? Reason I ask is because if we are just wanting to hunt efficiently meaning catch the most amount of hogs in a day it would be best just to use a dog that is strictly a bay dog solo or a bay and catch dog combo rather than mix a sighthound/bulldog. The bulldog could be a mix of anything whether it be apbt/AB, bully/grey, AB, whatever and the same with the hound but efficiency wise you will be best using a bay dog specifically (long range nose, speed, stamina, grit), and a catch dog. If I wanted a one out dog I would cross a BMC, Cat, to a apbt, AB instead of any type of sighthound. I may consider using a sighthound x bulldog if I was hunting on super flat terrain without much brush but even then I think I would use a good hound (baydog) instead . End the end the goal is to to harvest the hog and at the end of the day a baydog whether it be a cross or "purebred" will get to more hogs more consistently than any other type. In other words a baydog will get to a more hogs throughout a day than any type of sighthound or any type of bulldog or a combo of sight x bulldog. In texas, Georgia, Louisianna, etc, etc they have been using crosses for a long time to make "one out" dogs for a long time yet people who have hunted with purely a baydog side by side with a catch dog in comparison with a sighthound/bulldog cross or baydog/bulldog cross will tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt that simply using a baydog or baydog with a catch dog will harvest you the most. The multi function crosses produce good dogs no doubt and more than get the job done but they are jack of all trades, masters of none.
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Something else I thought I would add I would probably use a baydog in conjunction with a bully/grey cross as well or any fast bully cross but for efficiency I would use them alongside a good bay dog just for the mere fact that a good bay dog will scent a TON of hogs and has stamina for days. I have seen 18 hogs harvested in a day by bay dogs alone.
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A lot of guys here would disagree with you workman and they'd also have the 18 hogs in a day to back themselves up, and then some, with bull/sighthound crosses. Anything without sighthound isn't considered efficient enough for how they do things here, which isn't to say there aren't people who use dogs without sighthound, there are a lot, but they're frankly not usually amongst the more serious guys, or indeed the guys catching many many pigs in the one day. The main reason sighthound crosses are seen as most efficient is for when a herd of many pigs is come across, they'll run and catch one (or each run and catch a different one, if there are multiple dogs), and then "run on" after the person kills the pig they caught and go catch another one from the fleeing herd, and so on. Their speed enough to close the gap the herd makes while the first caught pig is being dispatched. Hogs aren't very fast so the speed sighthound crosses have is really excessive if the purpose was simply to run one down, where it really comes into play is running down multiple one after the other as the head start they get increases. The problem with a bay dog when it comes to efficiently bagging as many hogs as possible is that they're often noisy, giving pigs a head start before even one is caught, and thus stretching out the chase, in distance and time, and then they're also typically not that fast, which further stretches out the chase. What they will do is find hogs where a sighthound won't. Where pigs are scarce and you'd be lucky to catch one, that is where I think bay-dog types are going to be superior at ensuring one is found, somewhere, maybe far away and after a big drawn out trek across the country side, but you'll go home with pork where maybe with sighthound crosses you would have gone home empty handed. However where hogs are plentiful and big bag loads are possible I don't really see how sighthound crosses aren't the most efficient type to be using, it's a fairly simple principle where their speed and efficiency in running down a pig means more pigs per hour. There ofcourse must be a legitimate reason scenthounds and curs and cats are favoured in the states and sighthounds largely neglected, but I always assumed it was simply that the finds were longer and harder with less hogs as they haven't "overrun" the ecosystem there as they have here. I can see the point about open flat spaces but honestly sighthound crosses are favoured here in all sorts of country. I can only keep coming back to the assumption finds are easier here so finding ability can be sacrificed for athletic performance in the chase. I don't know it's interesting to note the different preferences in the two different cultures and I can only theorise on why but I think one thing for sure is both have come to their conclusion through genuine trial and error and neither is "wrong". There must have been genuine reasons each went the way they did. For whatever reason today sighthounds are decidedly unpopular in the states and scenthounds decidedly unpopular down under, each just having a few "eccentric" guys bucking the trend.
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I'm not sure what the visibility is like down under but the the US south east it's very limited by super dense brush. I can't imagine trying to hunt rabbits seriously with sight hounds here, beagles though are very successful. It may be a different game in west Texas, but here you'd have to stumble right on top of something with a sighthound and it would be easy to loose. From the video and pictures I've seen of hog hunters down under it does seem to have much lower brush and be much more open. I can see that making a big difference in the choice of sight vs scent hounds.
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[quote1333763565=Tonedog] True. I might make something slightly different, been thinking about outlining the different types that can contribute to a hybrid, what they potentially offer, both strengths and weaknesses, and then the top 5 breeds from each of these groups. I appreciate the interest anyway. [/quote1333763565] Found it: Brightest DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: Fewer than 5 repetitions. Obey First Command: 95% of the time or better.[17] 1.Border Collie, red and white short haired x APBT red nose. 2.Min. Poodle x American Hairless Terrier x Bulldog 3.German Shepherd, silver sable x Alaskan Malamute or black and black Great Dane 4.Golden Retriever x St Bernard, short haired 5.Doberman Pinscher x Greyhound, red 6.Shetland Sheepdog x SBT 7.Labrador Retriever, yellow x DDB 8.Papillon 9.Rottweiler x American Bully, black and tan 10.Australian Cattle Dog/Stumpy C189G mutation x APBT [edit] Excellent Working DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: 5 to 15 repetitions. Obey First Command: 85% of the time or better.[18] 11.Pembroke Welsh Corgi 12.Miniature Schnauzer 13.English Springer Spaniel 14.Belgian Shepherd Tervuren 15.Schipperke Belgian Sheepdog 16.Collie Keeshond 17.German Shorthaired Pointer 18.Flat-Coated Retriever English Cocker Spaniel Standard Schnauzer 19.Brittany 20.Cocker Spaniel 21.Weimaraner 22.Belgian Malinois Bernese Mountain Dog 23.Pomeranian 24.Irish Water Spaniel 25.Vizsla 26.Cardigan Welsh Corgi [edit] Above Average Working DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: 15 to 25 repetitions. Obey First Command: 70% of the time or better.[19] 27.Chesapeake Bay Retriever Puli Yorkshire Terrier 28.Giant Schnauzer 29.Airedale Terrier Bouvier des Flandres 30.Border Terrier Briard 31.Welsh Springer Spaniel 32.Manchester Terrier 33.Samoyed 34.Field Spaniel Newfoundland Australian Terrier American Staffordshire Terrier Gordon Setter Bearded Collie 35.Cairn Terrier Kerry Blue Terrier Irish Setter 36.Norwegian Elkhound 37.Affenpinscher Silky Terrier Miniature Pinscher English Setter Pharaoh Hound Clumber Spaniel 38.Norwich Terrier 39.Dalmatian [edit] Average Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 25 to 40 repetitions. Obey First Command: 50% of the time or better.[20] 40.Soft-Coated Wheaten Terrier Bedlington Terrier Fox Terrier (Smooth) 41.Curly Coated Retriever Irish Wolfhound 42.Kuvasz Australian Shepherd 43.Saluki Finnish Spitz Pointer 44.Cavalier King Charles Spaniel German Wirehaired Pointer Black and Tan Coonhound American Water Spaniel 45.Siberian Husky Bichon Frise English Toy Spaniel 46.Tibetan Spaniel English Foxhound Otterhound American Foxhound Greyhound Wirehaired Pointing Griffon 47.West Highland White Terrier Scottish Deerhound 48.Boxer54.Boston Terrier 49.Dachshund Staffordshire Bull Terrier 50.Alaskan Malamute 51.Whippet Chinese Shar Pei Wire Fox Terrier 52.Rhodesian Ridgeback 53.Ibizan Hound Welsh Terrier Irish Terrier 54.Boston Terrier,Great Dane,Akita [edit] Fair Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 40 to 80 repetitions. Obey First Command: 30% of the time or better.[21] 55.Skye Terrier 56.Norfolk Terrier Sealyham Terrier 57.Pug 58.French Bulldog 59.Brussels Griffon Maltese 60.Italian Greyhound 61.Chinese Crested 62.Dandie Dinmont Terrier Petit Basset Griffon Vendeen Tibetan Terrier Japanese Chin Lakeland Terrier 63.Old English Sheepdog 64.Great Pyrenees 65.Scottish Terrier Saint Bernard 66.Bull Terrier 67.Chihuahua 68.Lhasa Apso 69.Bullmastiff [edit] Lowest Degree of Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 80 to 100 repetitions or more. Obey First Command: 25% of the time or worse.[22] 70.Shih Tzu 71.Basset Hound 72.Mastiff 73.Beagle 74.Pekingese 75.Bloodhound 76.Borzoi 77.Chow Chow 78.Bulldog 79.Basenji 80.Afghan Hound RottweilerxAPBT=Bully/American Rottweiler American RottweilerxBoerboel(black)=Vorax American RottweilerxDDB=Dougin ARxAHT=American Rottweiler Terrier ARTxART= Hairless American Rottweiler 1. English bull terrier Pros- Courage, Grip, strength, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, combative composure cons- short legs/poor ground coverage, hard-headed, soft feet, dog aggression 2. Greyhound Pros- speed/acceleration, vision, height, good ground coverage, prey drive, often hard and brave for a sighthound, docility cons- gracility/lack of durability, poor grip, soft feet, thin skin, lack of bush intelligence, can sometimes be timid, doesn't use nose well, burns out quickly/won't work long 3. Wolfhound Pros- Size (height and strength), tough skin, hard feet, prey drive and bush smarts, nose, speed, ground coverage, very hard for a sighthound, killing bite and best grip of a sighthound, docility, good stamina for big dog cons- Poor health/short lifespan, slow to mature 4. Bullmastiff Pros- Grip, power, courage, durability, combative composure Cons- poor heat tolerance, slow, poor stamina 5. Great dane Pros- Size, nose, speed, prey drive, ground coverage cons- Poor health/short lifespan, slow to mature, average agility 6. Apbt Pros- Courage, Grip, strength, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, health, agility, stamina, combative composure Cons- soft feet, dog aggression, average ground coverage, illegal 7. Deerhound Pros- Speed, ground coverage, prey drive and bush smarts, tough skin, hard feet, vision, docility, stamina, one of the harder sighthounds, strong bite for a sighthound Cons- Slow to mature, somewhat gracile, still not the firmest grip 8. Boxer Pros- speed, energy, agility, courage, friendliness cons- Health, poor bite, hyperactive/goofiness 9. English mastiff Pros- size, power, grip, durability Cons- Health, slow/sluggish, poor stamina, slow to mature 10. American bulldog Pros- grip, courage, strength, determination, pain tolerance, composure Cons- Heat tolerance, nose, average speed 11. German shorthaired pointer Pros- Nose, energy, enthusiasm, stamina, speed, agility, bush smarts, good feet, good in water/swamps Cons- reluctance to lug, prone to aggression, ordinary pain tolerance 12. Rhodesian ridgeback Pros- Heat tolerance, stamina, speed, nose, agility Cons- unreliable lugger 13. Australian cattle dog Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, durability, agility, good bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, cagey/sneaky, prone to aggression 14. Catahoula Pros- Nose, stamina, speed, good feet, bush smarts, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug 15. Kelpie Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, agility, good bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug 16. Neapolitan mastiff Pros- Durability, power, pain tolerance, courage, grip, good in water/swamps, combative composure Cons- poor health, slow, heat tolerance, stamina, soft feet 17. Airedale terrier Pros- Nose, bush smarts and intelligence, stamina, agility, good feet, prey drive Cons- Somewhat lacking in durability, strength and speed 18. American staffordshire terrier Pros- Grip, strength, courage, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, composure cons- poor ground coverage, soft feet, dog aggression 19. Border Collie Pros- Intelligence, energy, stamina, enthusiasm, quickness, good bailer Cons- reluctance to lug, lack of durability and strength 20. Bloodhound Pros- Nose, determination on a trail, good voice/bailer, good feet Cons- Reluctance to lug, stubbornness on a trail, not very fast, noisy 21. Staffordshire bull terrier Pros- Grip, courage, agility, durability, compactness for getting about in thick scrub Cons- Very poor ground coverage/short legs, uses a lot of energy, average feet, heat tolerance and stamina can suffer from excessive muscle and short face 22. Coonhound Pros- Nose, determination on a trail, bush smarts, stamina, good feet, good voice/bailer, fast and agile, wary/cautious and safe Cons- Reluctance to lug, stubbornness on a trail, annoyingly noisy 23. Foxhound Pros- Nose, bush smarts, good feet, stamina, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, annoyingly noisy 24. Shar pei Pros- Grip, agility, composure cons- Health, cagey/sneaky, prone to aggression 25. Huntaway Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, agility Cons- Reluctance to lug, small 26. English pointer Pros- Nose, stamina, enthusiasm, good feet Cons- Not as smart as german pointers, reluctance to lug 27. German Wirehaired pointer Pros- Nose, stamina, enthusiasm, feet, tough coat Cons- Prone to aggression/cagey, reluctance to lug 28. Fila Brasileiro Pros- Grip, strength, courage, nose, durability Cons- fairly slow, prone to aggression, average stamina, illegal 29. Dogue de bordeaux Pros- Grip, strength, courage, durability Cons- inconsistency, poor heat tolerance and stamina 30. Cane corso Pros- Grip, strength, durability, athletic for a mastiff Cons- inconsistency, prone to lacking nerve 31. Black mouth curr Pros- Nose, enthusiasm/energy, good feet, good bush smarts, stamina, speed, wary/safe, durable Cons- unreliable lugger 32. Weimeraner Pros- Stamina, speed, nose, agility Cons- Reluctance to lug, lacks durability 33. Jagd terrier Pros- Courage, enthusiasm, nose, determination, good feet, agility, durability (so small it just bounces off) Cons- Small, Poor ground coverage and speed compared to bigger breeds, hard headed and stubborn, aggressive 34. Rottweiler Pros- Strength, grip, ok nose, intelligent Cons- Pain tolerance, composure and determination not as good as other luggers, can be surly and hard headed 35. Boerboel Pros- Grip, courage, pain tolerance, power, composure Cons- inconsistency, slow, poor stamina 36. Boston terrier Pros- spirited, enthusiastic and quick Cons- basically everything else, very small 37. Whippet Pros- Speed, quickness, agility, prey drive, vision, docile and quiet Cons- small, very thin skinned, delicate, poor tolerance for temperatures/weather 38. Labrador Pros- Intelligent, enthusiastic, nose Cons- Reluctance to lug/soft bite 39. Old english sheep dog Pros- Enthusiasm, confidence, energy Cons- Stubborn, can be aggressive and surly, coat too long 40. English bulldog Pros- instinct to grip, courage, determined and composed, strong Cons- Health and athleticism, deformed bite, very poor stamina, very slow, very poor ground coverage, very poor heat tolerance 41. Fox terrier Pros- Nose, enthusiasm, prey drive, tenacity, quickness Cons- prone to aggression, small, poor ground coverage 42. Otterhound Pros- Nose, good feet, durable skin/coat, tolerant of weather, good in water/swamps, good stamina and energy, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, not very fast 43. Hungarian Viszla Pros- speed, stamina, agility, nose Cons- Reluctance to lug, poor durability and pain tolerance 44. Saluki Pros- Anaerobic stamina, speed, ground coverage, prey drive Cons- Very delicate, thin skin, soft and timid, weak bite 45. Jack russel terrier Pros- nose, enthusiasm, tenacity, prey drive Cons- very small, very poor ground coverage/speed compared to big dogs, surly and aggressive 46. Borzoi Pros- Speed, stamina, ground coverage, prey drive Cons- Delicate, soft and wary, weak bite 47. Ibizan Hound Pros- Speed, prey drive, stamina, ground coverage Cons- Delicate, soft, weak bite
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@KeyserSoze I think a Cane Corso catahoula cross would make a great boar hunting dog.
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@KeyserSoze Their aren't any federal laws banning the APBT and fila brasileiro. They might be illegal in some cities or states but they're definitely not illegal in every city or state.
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@MidgardKennels In a way I agree with you. A dog that is 100% sight hound probably wouldn't be good for hunting in thick brush. I think that a sight hound cross could be great for hunting in thick brush if it was crossed with a dog that has good scenting ability. For example, I think a staghound/airdale cross might be good for hunting boar in thick brush. It would combine the speed of the staghound with the scenting ability of the airdale.
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In my opinion, the ideal boar hunting dog would have, speed, power, and a good nose. I think an excellent combination would be a molosser (one of the more athletic breeds)X sight hound X cur.
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Personally I would take a baydog like a cat or BMC over a sighthound just for the finding ability alone. Keep in mind 9/10 times in the woods you have to find the hog which is more often than not very far away and certainly out of range of vision
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ah ok just re-read your post tone. If I was to come across a herd of pig I would absolutely favor sight hounds in terms of efficiency just based on speed alone. That said I don't see people coming across herds here unless they have put feeders out. A good Catahoula will be prolly be fairly close to if not as fast a a bully/sighthound cross. I will say for discussion purposes that a bully/sighthound cross is faster but I wouldn't be suprised a bit if they weren't.
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@workman43113 Do catahoulas and black mouth curs make a lot of noise when they're tracking an animal?
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Well the dude I got my bull arab off bred catahoulas as well as bull arabs, and did some cat/arab litters. Actually makes me suspicious a bit of cat might be in my arab cause he barks too much and f**kin loud. Seems to know how to use barking as a weapon in skirmishes with my dad's bandog, and ran down and bayed up a deer the other day. Was actually really awesome, found it hiding in an overgrown patch of grass and weeds, flushed it out and ran it across a field (was right on it/under it the whole way), then ran it through a forest and creek with branches breaking and water splashing, then popped out the other side with it, brought it to a stop and bayed it up forcing me choose between calling him off or bashing the deer over the head with a rock, I called him off. It was cool but most arabs would lug at his age (9 months), although maybe not the first beast they got close and personal with. We'll see how he goes. Physically his grip is awesome and can easily support his whole body with violent shaking. Anyway what this breeder said would support what you're saying sort of in that he said arabs and cats aren't that different as far as speed goes (he said as far as anything goes, he considered cats pretty much like american arabs, which I think is wrong, and again makes me suspicious my arab has cat in it), however arabs are maybe a step slower than straight bull/greys usually. But yeah it's a fair point that cats are still really really fast and there wouldn't be a huge difference between them and bull/greys. Top speed undoubtedly very very close, maybe acceleration having a slight difference. They undoubtedly have some sighthound in them themselves. I guess though in a herd situation baying in itself takes up time that could be spent running on to the next pig. In the event where bones just bayed that deer, he was close enough to lug it up for the whole chase, there was an extra 400 metres or so of chase due to the fact he was nipping at it and running it while right on top of it, basically just took a lot longer to pull it up than if he just torpedoed in and lugged it as soon as he was close enough. Silent torpedoing clean holders catching as fast and efficiently as possible and running on are going to catch more pigs out of a herd than a bay dog even if it is as fast. But yeah the bay dog will find pigs in thick brush that a bull/sighthound might not, and then also help you find it and the pig. Mind you it should be known that there are bull/sighthounds that have been great finders with great noses and in thick forest, but it seems to just be the odd individual develops into a great finder, not typical of the breed.
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[quote1333838909=Gamebred] @workman43113 Do catahoulas and black mouth curs make a lot of noise when they're tracking an animal? [/quote1333838909] yeah they will bark alot but some people have silent dogs believe it or not. It's all in the selection of individuals and in the breeding which is what makes the aussie dogs so good as well. I like a dog that barks to the bay just so I can know where they are at but more often than not by the time they bay something up they are so far away that if you can even hear the bark you can't pin point exactly where it is coming from right away which is why many people are using collars Oh and sorry man I accidentally "reported" your post meaning to click the quote button.
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[quote1333839264=Tonedog] Well the dude I got my bull arab off bred catahoulas as well as bull arabs, and did some cat/arab litters. Actually makes me suspicious a bit of cat might be in my arab cause he barks too much and f**kin loud. Seems to know how to use barking as a weapon in skirmishes with my dad's bandog, and ran down and bayed up a deer the other day. Was actually really awesome, found it hiding in an overgrown patch of grass and weeds, flushed it out and ran it across a field (was right on it/under it the whole way), then ran it through a forest and creek with branches breaking and water splashing, then popped out the other side with it, brought it to a stop and bayed it up forcing me choose between calling him off or bashing the deer over the head with a rock, I called him off. It was cool but most arabs would lug at his age (9 months), although maybe not the first beast they got close and personal with. We'll see how he goes. Physically his grip is awesome and can easily support his whole body with violent shaking. Anyway what this breeder said would support what you're saying sort of in that he said arabs and cats aren't that different as far as speed goes (he said as far as anything goes, he considered cats pretty much like american arabs, which I think is wrong, and again makes me suspicious my arab has cat in it), however arabs are maybe a step slower than straight bull/greys usually. But yeah it's a fair point that cats are still really really fast and there wouldn't be a huge difference between them and bull/greys. Top speed undoubtedly very very close, maybe acceleration having a slight difference. They undoubtedly have some sighthound in them themselves. I guess though in a herd situation baying in itself takes up time that could be spent running on to the next pig. In the event where bones just bayed that deer, he was close enough to lug it up for the whole chase, there was an extra 400 metres or so of chase due to the fact he was nipping at it and running it while right on top of it, basically just took a lot longer to pull it up than if he just torpedoed in and lugged it as soon as he was close enough. Silent torpedoing clean holders catching as fast and efficiently as possible and running on are going to catch more pigs out of a herd than a bay dog even if it is as fast. But yeah the bay dog will find pigs in thick brush that a bull/sighthound might not, and then also help you find it and the pig. Mind you it should be known that there are bull/sighthounds that have been great finders with great noses and in thick forest, but it seems to just be the odd individual develops into a great finder, not typical of the breed. [/quote1333839264] That's actually pretty fascinating. Your dog might be pretty tough in a weird way then. I have seen alot of Cat's and BMC's actually run apbt's and AB's off because of they way they choose to fight with them by darting in and out and biting the shit out of them then running circles around them, lol. Really good tactic actually, (R) thats right I posted a rainbow, whats up
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[quote1333839393=KeyserSoze] [quote1333763565=Tonedog] True. I might make something slightly different, been thinking about outlining the different types that can contribute to a hybrid, what they potentially offer, both strengths and weaknesses, and then the top 5 breeds from each of these groups. I appreciate the interest anyway. [/quote1333763565] Found it: Brightest DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: Fewer than 5 repetitions. Obey First Command: 95% of the time or better.[17] 1.Border Collie, red and white short haired x APBT red nose. 2.Min. Poodle x American Hairless Terrier x Bulldog 3.German Shepherd, silver sable x Alaskan Malamute or black and black Great Dane 4.Golden Retriever x St Bernard, short haired 5.Doberman Pinscher x Greyhound, red 6.Shetland Sheepdog x SBT 7.Labrador Retriever, yellow x DDB 8.Papillon 9.Rottweiler x American Bully, black and tan 10.Australian Cattle Dog/Stumpy C189G mutation x APBT [edit] Excellent Working DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: 5 to 15 repetitions. Obey First Command: 85% of the time or better.[18] 11.Pembroke Welsh Corgi 12.Miniature Schnauzer 13.English Springer Spaniel 14.Belgian Shepherd Tervuren 15.Schipperke Belgian Sheepdog 16.Collie Keeshond 17.German Shorthaired Pointer 18.Flat-Coated Retriever English Cocker Spaniel Standard Schnauzer 19.Brittany 20.Cocker Spaniel 21.Weimaraner 22.Belgian Malinois Bernese Mountain Dog 23.Pomeranian 24.Irish Water Spaniel 25.Vizsla 26.Cardigan Welsh Corgi [edit] Above Average Working DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: 15 to 25 repetitions. Obey First Command: 70% of the time or better.[19] 27.Chesapeake Bay Retriever Puli Yorkshire Terrier 28.Giant Schnauzer 29.Airedale Terrier Bouvier des Flandres 30.Border Terrier Briard 31.Welsh Springer Spaniel 32.Manchester Terrier 33.Samoyed 34.Field Spaniel Newfoundland Australian Terrier American Staffordshire Terrier Gordon Setter Bearded Collie 35.Cairn Terrier Kerry Blue Terrier Irish Setter 36.Norwegian Elkhound 37.Affenpinscher Silky Terrier Miniature Pinscher English Setter Pharaoh Hound Clumber Spaniel 38.Norwich Terrier 39.Dalmatian [edit] Average Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 25 to 40 repetitions. Obey First Command: 50% of the time or better.[20] 40.Soft-Coated Wheaten Terrier Bedlington Terrier Fox Terrier (Smooth) 41.Curly Coated Retriever Irish Wolfhound 42.Kuvasz Australian Shepherd 43.Saluki Finnish Spitz Pointer 44.Cavalier King Charles Spaniel German Wirehaired Pointer Black and Tan Coonhound American Water Spaniel 45.Siberian Husky Bichon Frise English Toy Spaniel 46.Tibetan Spaniel English Foxhound Otterhound American Foxhound Greyhound Wirehaired Pointing Griffon 47.West Highland White Terrier Scottish Deerhound 48.Boxer54.Boston Terrier 49.Dachshund Staffordshire Bull Terrier 50.Alaskan Malamute 51.Whippet Chinese Shar Pei Wire Fox Terrier 52.Rhodesian Ridgeback 53.Ibizan Hound Welsh Terrier Irish Terrier 54.Boston Terrier,Great Dane,Akita [edit] Fair Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 40 to 80 repetitions. Obey First Command: 30% of the time or better.[21] 55.Skye Terrier 56.Norfolk Terrier Sealyham Terrier 57.Pug 58.French Bulldog 59.Brussels Griffon Maltese 60.Italian Greyhound 61.Chinese Crested 62.Dandie Dinmont Terrier Petit Basset Griffon Vendeen Tibetan Terrier Japanese Chin Lakeland Terrier 63.Old English Sheepdog 64.Great Pyrenees 65.Scottish Terrier Saint Bernard 66.Bull Terrier 67.Chihuahua 68.Lhasa Apso 69.Bullmastiff [edit] Lowest Degree of Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 80 to 100 repetitions or more. Obey First Command: 25% of the time or worse.[22] 70.Shih Tzu 71.Basset Hound 72.Mastiff 73.Beagle 74.Pekingese 75.Bloodhound 76.Borzoi 77.Chow Chow 78.Bulldog 79.Basenji 80.Afghan Hound RottweilerxAPBT=Bully/American Rottweiler American RottweilerxBoerboel(black)=Vorax American RottweilerxDDB=Dougin ARxAHT=American Rottweiler Terrier ARTxART= Hairless American Rottweiler 1. English bull terrier Pros- Courage, Grip, strength, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, combative composure cons- short legs/poor ground coverage, hard-headed, soft feet, dog aggression 2. Greyhound Pros- speed/acceleration, vision, height, good ground coverage, prey drive, often hard and brave for a sighthound, docility cons- gracility/lack of durability, poor grip, soft feet, thin skin, lack of bush intelligence, can sometimes be timid, doesn't use nose well, burns out quickly/won't work long 3. Wolfhound Pros- Size (height and strength), tough skin, hard feet, prey drive and bush smarts, nose, speed, ground coverage, very hard for a sighthound, killing bite and best grip of a sighthound, docility, good stamina for big dog cons- Poor health/short lifespan, slow to mature 4. Bullmastiff Pros- Grip, power, courage, durability, combative composure Cons- poor heat tolerance, slow, poor stamina 5. Great dane Pros- Size, nose, speed, prey drive, ground coverage cons- Poor health/short lifespan, slow to mature, average agility 6. Apbt Pros- Courage, Grip, strength, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, health, agility, stamina, combative composure Cons- soft feet, dog aggression, average ground coverage, illegal 7. Deerhound Pros- Speed, ground coverage, prey drive and bush smarts, tough skin, hard feet, vision, docility, stamina, one of the harder sighthounds, strong bite for a sighthound Cons- Slow to mature, somewhat gracile, still not the firmest grip 8. Boxer Pros- speed, energy, agility, courage, friendliness cons- Health, poor bite, hyperactive/goofiness 9. English mastiff Pros- size, power, grip, durability Cons- Health, slow/sluggish, poor stamina, slow to mature 10. American bulldog Pros- grip, courage, strength, determination, pain tolerance, composure Cons- Heat tolerance, nose, average speed 11. German shorthaired pointer Pros- Nose, energy, enthusiasm, stamina, speed, agility, bush smarts, good feet, good in water/swamps Cons- reluctance to lug, prone to aggression, ordinary pain tolerance 12. Rhodesian ridgeback Pros- Heat tolerance, stamina, speed, nose, agility Cons- unreliable lugger 13. Australian cattle dog Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, durability, agility, good bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, cagey/sneaky, prone to aggression 14. Catahoula Pros- Nose, stamina, speed, good feet, bush smarts, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug 15. Kelpie Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, agility, good bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug 16. Neapolitan mastiff Pros- Durability, power, pain tolerance, courage, grip, good in water/swamps, combative composure Cons- poor health, slow, heat tolerance, stamina, soft feet 17. Airedale terrier Pros- Nose, bush smarts and intelligence, stamina, agility, good feet, prey drive Cons- Somewhat lacking in durability, strength and speed 18. American staffordshire terrier Pros- Grip, strength, courage, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, composure cons- poor ground coverage, soft feet, dog aggression 19. Border Collie Pros- Intelligence, energy, stamina, enthusiasm, quickness, good bailer Cons- reluctance to lug, lack of durability and strength 20. Bloodhound Pros- Nose, determination on a trail, good voice/bailer, good feet Cons- Reluctance to lug, stubbornness on a trail, not very fast, noisy 21. Staffordshire bull terrier Pros- Grip, courage, agility, durability, compactness for getting about in thick scrub Cons- Very poor ground coverage/short legs, uses a lot of energy, average feet, heat tolerance and stamina can suffer from excessive muscle and short face 22. Coonhound Pros- Nose, determination on a trail, bush smarts, stamina, good feet, good voice/bailer, fast and agile, wary/cautious and safe Cons- Reluctance to lug, stubbornness on a trail, annoyingly noisy 23. Foxhound Pros- Nose, bush smarts, good feet, stamina, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, annoyingly noisy 24. Shar pei Pros- Grip, agility, composure cons- Health, cagey/sneaky, prone to aggression 25. Huntaway Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, agility Cons- Reluctance to lug, small 26. English pointer Pros- Nose, stamina, enthusiasm, good feet Cons- Not as smart as german pointers, reluctance to lug 27. German Wirehaired pointer Pros- Nose, stamina, enthusiasm, feet, tough coat Cons- Prone to aggression/cagey, reluctance to lug 28. Fila Brasileiro Pros- Grip, strength, courage, nose, durability Cons- fairly slow, prone to aggression, average stamina, illegal 29. Dogue de bordeaux Pros- Grip, strength, courage, durability Cons- inconsistency, poor heat tolerance and stamina 30. Cane corso Pros- Grip, strength, durability, athletic for a mastiff Cons- inconsistency, prone to lacking nerve 31. Black mouth curr Pros- Nose, enthusiasm/energy, good feet, good bush smarts, stamina, speed, wary/safe, durable Cons- unreliable lugger 32. Weimeraner Pros- Stamina, speed, nose, agility Cons- Reluctance to lug, lacks durability 33. Jagd terrier Pros- Courage, enthusiasm, nose, determination, good feet, agility, durability (so small it just bounces off) Cons- Small, Poor ground coverage and speed compared to bigger breeds, hard headed and stubborn, aggressive 34. Rottweiler Pros- Strength, grip, ok nose, intelligent Cons- Pain tolerance, composure and determination not as good as other luggers, can be surly and hard headed 35. Boerboel Pros- Grip, courage, pain tolerance, power, composure Cons- inconsistency, slow, poor stamina 36. Boston terrier Pros- spirited, enthusiastic and quick Cons- basically everything else, very small 37. Whippet Pros- Speed, quickness, agility, prey drive, vision, docile and quiet Cons- small, very thin skinned, delicate, poor tolerance for temperatures/weather 38. Labrador Pros- Intelligent, enthusiastic, nose Cons- Reluctance to lug/soft bite 39. Old english sheep dog Pros- Enthusiasm, confidence, energy Cons- Stubborn, can be aggressive and surly, coat too long 40. English bulldog Pros- instinct to grip, courage, determined and composed, strong Cons- Health and athleticism, deformed bite, very poor stamina, very slow, very poor ground coverage, very poor heat tolerance 41. Fox terrier Pros- Nose, enthusiasm, prey drive, tenacity, quickness Cons- prone to aggression, small, poor ground coverage 42. Otterhound Pros- Nose, good feet, durable skin/coat, tolerant of weather, good in water/swamps, good stamina and energy, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, not very fast 43. Hungarian Viszla Pros- speed, stamina, agility, nose Cons- Reluctance to lug, poor durability and pain tolerance 44. Saluki Pros- Anaerobic stamina, speed, ground coverage, prey drive Cons- Very delicate, thin skin, soft and timid, weak bite 45. Jack russel terrier Pros- nose, enthusiasm, tenacity, prey drive Cons- very small, very poor ground coverage/speed compared to big dogs, surly and aggressive 46. Borzoi Pros- Speed, stamina, ground coverage, prey drive Cons- Delicate, soft and wary, weak bite 47. Ibizan Hound Pros- Speed, prey drive, stamina, ground coverage Cons- Delicate, soft, weak bite [/quote1333839393] KeyserSoze You are Vorax with a changed IP. Everybody can see it with some brain left. It is funny, you have been banned here for a few times, but you appear on the same day witha new IP and nobody notices it here. The thing with DNA cluster and with the Presa Canario being one of the oldest breeds you have already told on Carnivora and here: http://sunnyak.forenworld.at/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=871&p=10261&hilit=Vorax#p10261 acamper said: Vorax I can't recall but just out of curiousity aren't you on MD under a different name? I go there and see you catch a little shit at times. That's an interesting dog the American Alsatian, nice mix as well. Vorax said: Yup that's me ;) If you want the proof, post number 12 and 13 on this page: http://sunnyak.forenworld.at/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=871&p=9972&hilit=Vorax#p9972
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I just assumed it was clear to everyone keysersoze is obviously vorax, it's been comically extremely obvious from the start. I figure it's tolerated cause he's really pretty harmless (unlike some people). That's why I tolerate it anyway (think I'm still a mod?). [quote1333846310=workman43113] That's actually pretty fascinating. Your dog might be pretty tough in a weird way then. I have seen alot of Cat's and BMC's actually run apbt's and AB's off because of they way they choose to fight with them by darting in and out and biting the shit out of them then running circles around them, lol. Really good tactic actually, (R) thats right I posted a rainbow, whats up [/quote1333846310] Yeah he is tough, like he'll go in for the close-quarter contest and he's rough and ready for it, it's just if he starts losing the upper hand he'll change tactics, make space, evade attacks (not running away just weaving lunges) bark in the other dogs face untill it starts to turn it's head out of annoyance and then jump on them and grab the back of their neck again, lol. He's an assh*le, basically. I don't think this means he's a "bay dog" for life or anything, it's typical for dogs to start with baying, then start joining in on the lug if another dog is present, then start lugging one on one on smaller pigs and ultimately lug one on one on any thing. A bull terrier or ambull might just always be a lugger 100% from birth, and some bull arabs will be as well. For that matter this dude told me some catahoulas even will be too?? But yeah lots of good hard dogs that end up as full luggers will start off baying as green youngsters. I think it's a good thing to be a skillfull talented bayer as well, for the dog to have that in his arsenal if he needs it. It's not just not-lugging, it's a technique and talent in itself. But yeah I also want lugging in the arsenal. I'm pretty confident bones has it in him and will develop it. Will develop both. I'm growing an appreciation for baying watching him work, more so than being disappointed he's not that hardcore no-hesitation lugging torpedo type. Now I feel like I want that splash of baying tendency in future all-rounder type dogs I have. It seems more adaptive and versatile to have a balance of both (although I'm under no illusions he wouldn't usually get whomped in a close quarter quarrel with a straight bulldog). Cool bow bro btw.
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[quote1333847788=Tonedog] I just assumed it was clear to everyone keysersoze is obviously vorax, it's been comically extremely obvious from the start. I figure it's tolerated cause he's really pretty harmless (unlike some people). That's why I tolerate it anyway (think I'm still a mod?). [/quote1333847788] OK, you noticed it, good to know. Did Gary notice it too and just tolerate that he came back with another name right after being banned and calling the people here rats :O *-) 04.04.2012 Vorax wrote: Basically the site owner gravitates towards malicious people that were his own mods and tried to erase his forum before deleting their accounts and are now on the 13th legion working dog forum instead. The remaining people like Davidfitness83 were banned from other forums and just like to provoke people and make Gary his servant. Just not a respectable crowd and is more like a blog than a forum. I'm not a rat and have nothing to do with rats. It is not nice what he is writing about MolosserDogs here.: http://sunnyak.forenworld.at/viewtopic.php?f=29&p=10903#p10903
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lol I only called BVLGARIA a rat. Happy Easter to my fellow dog lovers.
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Then it is OK, Vorax if you only were talking to her. So Gray was informed that he banned you as Vorax and you at once came back as KeyserSoze. I didn´t know that it was a deal between you both and Gary knew it. Well, the rest was addressed to Davidfitness, Tonedog and some others, so it is OK, nobody has to like all the members of a board.
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I guess it´s a Bullmastiffs x Greyhound, but not worse than the other cross.
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[quote1333878360=Il-Leone] Then it is OK, Vorax if you only were talking to her. So Gray was informed that he banned you as Vorax and you at once came back as KeyserSoze. I didn´t know that it was a deal between you both and Gary knew it. Well, the rest was addressed to Davidfitness, Tonedog and some others, so it is OK, nobody has to like all the members of a board. [/quote1333878360] Gary obviously was not informed, so it was no deal between you and Gary to come back with another name, right after being banned. I read this thread again, but won´t post it anymore, neither here nor in the chatbox. You called the side owner of MD an iidiot and this is not tolerable! Vorax wrote: Now Lee is complaining the Moderator Tonedog is making personal attacks on him lol To top it all off Gary makes an off topic post directed only to them and leaves the posts up for all to see. The guy is an idiot. Definitely not tolerable! The other people who wrote in this thread at least were not using such words directed to the side owner, or in general to persons here and just mentioned reasons for decisions they made.
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Guess the obvious question is, who are you Il-Leone? Something tells me you're not just some new face with 11 posts, might be the fact you're so fixated on past drama and the like, you're obviously a "somebody" who had something to do with all the drama, on one side of the fence or the other, so who? Or is that just a secret?
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I read here for a while that´s right. I had no account so. Google searches always lead you to the same boards, no matter if you google Bully Kutta, CAO or whatever, so you see the same people posting and discussing on different boards. I read that politics were going on inside the board and that they might have been the bigger thread than Vorax aka KeyserSoze, because the people had some power (moderator status), but I think calling the Admin here an iidiot and still posting here, just doesn´t fit well. Would you agree on that part?
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Normally I would, but again I just truly don't take vorax seriously at all. I just can't muster up the enthusiasm to be outraged or even care a little bit. Lol. To me it's so obvious he was trying to fit in with andreas and co and I just don't see any real sinister intention behind anything he says. He "insulted" me as well at sunny's board but whatever, I just honestly don't care. I don't feel insulted. He failed if that was his intention. Gary might (feel insulted) and he might grant your wish and punish vorax, we'll have to wait and see.
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[quote1333885299=Tonedog] Normally I would, but again I just truly don't take vorax seriously at all. Gary might (feel insulted) and he might grant your wish and punish vorax, we'll have to wait and see. [/quote1333885299] He seems more to be a lightweight, so far you are right. [quote1333885299=Tonedog] Gary might (feel insulted) and he might grant your wish and punish vorax, we'll have to wait and see. [/quote1333885299] Well, maybe it makes no sense because he comes back with a new name and IP the next day, but a side without advertisement costs cash and normally you don´t pay for people who call you an iidiot. OK, back to dogs again: This dog looks like a nice hunting cross apbt x Ridgeback: http://i7.tinypic.com/7x179mb.jpg
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Well I visited my cousin today for easter and he's got a new pup, 5 month old wolfhound/deerhound x arab bitch. Already catching pigs, and already faster than his ridgeback x bullmastiff. Some pics- They together caught 9 pigs in one outing just 2 days ago. And his retired wolfhound/bm-
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[quote1333891427=Tonedog] [/quote1333891427] My first thought was shave it and you can sell it as Bully Kutta. Should be quite big soon.
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Mastiff x Greyhound: Do you prefer Deerhound mixes to Greyhound mixes? What I have noticed is that no matter if the female or male is a Greyhound, it always takes away a lot of head size! With Deerhounds and IWHs this might be not that much the case.
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yeah tone your dog def doesn't give me the impression he is a baydog. Seems to me to be a rougher grittier style dog than a baydog would be
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[quote1333896358=Tonedog] Guess the obvious question is, who are you Il-Leone? Something tells me you're not just some new face with 11 posts, might be the fact you're so fixated on past drama and the like, you're obviously a "somebody" who had something to do with all the drama, on one side of the fence or the other, so who? Or is that just a secret? [/quote1333896358] Some of us are men and suck it up and then you have the scandalmongers with nothing better to do on Easter Sunday than to stir up controversy. Keyword by this trouble maker is politics and all they are here for, probably BVLGARI after this post yesterday on his board: BVLGARI Post subject: Re: why did so many people leave MolosserDogs? Unread postPosted: 07.04.2012, 21:27 Joined: 19.01.2012, 00:11 Posts: 53 Gender: Female I completely agree with U, that's why I wonder why U still post there as KeyserSoze? I don't think U can get proper info from them. I mean in the end it is U who r helping them. What's the reason behind still helping MD after U have been banned twice before? I would have never try to change my IP to get on board again. Why should I? It was them who lost me, not me who lost MolosserDogs. That´s the way i look at things.
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I'm not a christian but I think the story of Jesus alone should give us all something to admire and strive for instead of bicker and argue. Happy Easter and blessings to you all from molosserdogs resident "atheist" if you want to call me that.
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@Il-Leone That mastiff greyhound lurcher looks like it would make a great hunting dog. The only bad thing about it is that it would be really hard to train.
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@Tonedog Your cousins dogs look amazing. It would be great if more modern bulldogs and mastiffs looked like the bullmastiffXridgeback.
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[quote1333918151=workman43113] I'm not a christian but I think the story of Jesus alone should give us all something to admire and strive for instead of bicker and argue. Happy Easter and blessings to you all from molosserdogs resident "atheist" if you want to call me that. [/quote1333918151] (R)
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[quote1333924078=Gamebred] @Il-Leone That mastiff greyhound lurcher looks like it would make a great hunting dog. The only bad thing about it is that it would be really hard to train. [/quote1333924078] You don't really believe that is a MastiffxGreyhound do you? I mean have you seen the first post and even the usual Bully Greys and Bull Lurchers have bigger heads than that from an EBT or APBT, never mind a mastiff lol
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Il-Leone, the apbt/ridgeback you posted looks a lot like a male version on my girl! [br][link={e_FILE}public/1333939707_18699_FT85870_laika.jpg][img:width=500&height=333]{e_FILE}public/1333939707_18699_FT85870_laika_.jpg">[/link][br]
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[quote1334076279=JesusChrist] [quote1333924078=Gamebred] @Il-Leone That mastiff greyhound lurcher looks like it would make a great hunting dog. The only bad thing about it is that it would be really hard to train. [/quote1333924078] You don't really believe that is a MastiffxGreyhound do you? I mean have you seen the first post and even the usual Bully Greys and Bull Lurchers have bigger heads than that from an EBT or APBT, never mind a mastiff lol [/quote1334076279] Why not, especially if it was a greyhound bitch, beside that are greyhounds pretty much line bred, so they have quite dominant genes. @Gamebred I agree, the dog could be pretty stubborn. [quote1334076392=Castanha] Il-Leone, the apbt/ridgeback you posted looks a lot like a male version on my girl! [br][link={e_FILE}public/1333939707_18699_FT85870_laika.jpg][img:width=500&height=333]{e_FILE}public/1333939707_18699_FT85870_laika_.jpg">[/link][br] [/quote1334076392] Definitely pretty similar, your dog looks beautiful by the way. (Very athletic.) Congrats. :)
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[quote1334106327=Il-Leone] [quote1333839393=KeyserSoze] [quote1333763565=Tonedog] True. I might make something slightly different, been thinking about outlining the different types that can contribute to a hybrid, what they potentially offer, both strengths and weaknesses, and then the top 5 breeds from each of these groups. I appreciate the interest anyway. [/quote1333763565] Found it: Brightest DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: Fewer than 5 repetitions. Obey First Command: 95% of the time or better.[17] 1.Border Collie, red and white short haired x APBT red nose. 2.Min. Poodle x American Hairless Terrier x Bulldog 3.German Shepherd, silver sable x Alaskan Malamute or black and black Great Dane 4.Golden Retriever x St Bernard, short haired 5.Doberman Pinscher x Greyhound, red 6.Shetland Sheepdog x SBT 7.Labrador Retriever, yellow x DDB 8.Papillon 9.Rottweiler x American Bully, black and tan 10.Australian Cattle Dog/Stumpy C189G mutation x APBT [edit] Excellent Working DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: 5 to 15 repetitions. Obey First Command: 85% of the time or better.[18] 11.Pembroke Welsh Corgi 12.Miniature Schnauzer 13.English Springer Spaniel 14.Belgian Shepherd Tervuren 15.Schipperke Belgian Sheepdog 16.Collie Keeshond 17.German Shorthaired Pointer 18.Flat-Coated Retriever English Cocker Spaniel Standard Schnauzer 19.Brittany 20.Cocker Spaniel 21.Weimaraner 22.Belgian Malinois Bernese Mountain Dog 23.Pomeranian 24.Irish Water Spaniel 25.Vizsla 26.Cardigan Welsh Corgi [edit] Above Average Working DogsUnderstanding of New Commands: 15 to 25 repetitions. Obey First Command: 70% of the time or better.[19] 27.Chesapeake Bay Retriever Puli Yorkshire Terrier 28.Giant Schnauzer 29.Airedale Terrier Bouvier des Flandres 30.Border Terrier Briard 31.Welsh Springer Spaniel 32.Manchester Terrier 33.Samoyed 34.Field Spaniel Newfoundland Australian Terrier American Staffordshire Terrier Gordon Setter Bearded Collie 35.Cairn Terrier Kerry Blue Terrier Irish Setter 36.Norwegian Elkhound 37.Affenpinscher Silky Terrier Miniature Pinscher English Setter Pharaoh Hound Clumber Spaniel 38.Norwich Terrier 39.Dalmatian [edit] Average Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 25 to 40 repetitions. Obey First Command: 50% of the time or better.[20] 40.Soft-Coated Wheaten Terrier Bedlington Terrier Fox Terrier (Smooth) 41.Curly Coated Retriever Irish Wolfhound 42.Kuvasz Australian Shepherd 43.Saluki Finnish Spitz Pointer 44.Cavalier King Charles Spaniel German Wirehaired Pointer Black and Tan Coonhound American Water Spaniel 45.Siberian Husky Bichon Frise English Toy Spaniel 46.Tibetan Spaniel English Foxhound Otterhound American Foxhound Greyhound Wirehaired Pointing Griffon 47.West Highland White Terrier Scottish Deerhound 48.Boxer54.Boston Terrier 49.Dachshund Staffordshire Bull Terrier 50.Alaskan Malamute 51.Whippet Chinese Shar Pei Wire Fox Terrier 52.Rhodesian Ridgeback 53.Ibizan Hound Welsh Terrier Irish Terrier 54.Boston Terrier,Great Dane,Akita [edit] Fair Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 40 to 80 repetitions. Obey First Command: 30% of the time or better.[21] 55.Skye Terrier 56.Norfolk Terrier Sealyham Terrier 57.Pug 58.French Bulldog 59.Brussels Griffon Maltese 60.Italian Greyhound 61.Chinese Crested 62.Dandie Dinmont Terrier Petit Basset Griffon Vendeen Tibetan Terrier Japanese Chin Lakeland Terrier 63.Old English Sheepdog 64.Great Pyrenees 65.Scottish Terrier Saint Bernard 66.Bull Terrier 67.Chihuahua 68.Lhasa Apso 69.Bullmastiff [edit] Lowest Degree of Working/Obedience IntelligenceUnderstanding of New Commands: 80 to 100 repetitions or more. Obey First Command: 25% of the time or worse.[22] 70.Shih Tzu 71.Basset Hound 72.Mastiff 73.Beagle 74.Pekingese 75.Bloodhound 76.Borzoi 77.Chow Chow 78.Bulldog 79.Basenji 80.Afghan Hound RottweilerxAPBT=Bully/American Rottweiler American RottweilerxBoerboel(black)=Vorax American RottweilerxDDB=Dougin ARxAHT=American Rottweiler Terrier ARTxART= Hairless American Rottweiler 1. English bull terrier Pros- Courage, Grip, strength, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, combative composure cons- short legs/poor ground coverage, hard-headed, soft feet, dog aggression 2. Greyhound Pros- speed/acceleration, vision, height, good ground coverage, prey drive, often hard and brave for a sighthound, docility cons- gracility/lack of durability, poor grip, soft feet, thin skin, lack of bush intelligence, can sometimes be timid, doesn't use nose well, burns out quickly/won't work long 3. Wolfhound Pros- Size (height and strength), tough skin, hard feet, prey drive and bush smarts, nose, speed, ground coverage, very hard for a sighthound, killing bite and best grip of a sighthound, docility, good stamina for big dog cons- Poor health/short lifespan, slow to mature 4. Bullmastiff Pros- Grip, power, courage, durability, combative composure Cons- poor heat tolerance, slow, poor stamina 5. Great dane Pros- Size, nose, speed, prey drive, ground coverage cons- Poor health/short lifespan, slow to mature, average agility 6. Apbt Pros- Courage, Grip, strength, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, health, agility, stamina, combative composure Cons- soft feet, dog aggression, average ground coverage, illegal 7. Deerhound Pros- Speed, ground coverage, prey drive and bush smarts, tough skin, hard feet, vision, docility, stamina, one of the harder sighthounds, strong bite for a sighthound Cons- Slow to mature, somewhat gracile, still not the firmest grip 8. Boxer Pros- speed, energy, agility, courage, friendliness cons- Health, poor bite, hyperactive/goofiness 9. English mastiff Pros- size, power, grip, durability Cons- Health, slow/sluggish, poor stamina, slow to mature 10. American bulldog Pros- grip, courage, strength, determination, pain tolerance, composure Cons- Heat tolerance, nose, average speed 11. German shorthaired pointer Pros- Nose, energy, enthusiasm, stamina, speed, agility, bush smarts, good feet, good in water/swamps Cons- reluctance to lug, prone to aggression, ordinary pain tolerance 12. Rhodesian ridgeback Pros- Heat tolerance, stamina, speed, nose, agility Cons- unreliable lugger 13. Australian cattle dog Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, durability, agility, good bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, cagey/sneaky, prone to aggression 14. Catahoula Pros- Nose, stamina, speed, good feet, bush smarts, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug 15. Kelpie Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, agility, good bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug 16. Neapolitan mastiff Pros- Durability, power, pain tolerance, courage, grip, good in water/swamps, combative composure Cons- poor health, slow, heat tolerance, stamina, soft feet 17. Airedale terrier Pros- Nose, bush smarts and intelligence, stamina, agility, good feet, prey drive Cons- Somewhat lacking in durability, strength and speed 18. American staffordshire terrier Pros- Grip, strength, courage, durability, prey drive, pain tolerance, determination, composure cons- poor ground coverage, soft feet, dog aggression 19. Border Collie Pros- Intelligence, energy, stamina, enthusiasm, quickness, good bailer Cons- reluctance to lug, lack of durability and strength 20. Bloodhound Pros- Nose, determination on a trail, good voice/bailer, good feet Cons- Reluctance to lug, stubbornness on a trail, not very fast, noisy 21. Staffordshire bull terrier Pros- Grip, courage, agility, durability, compactness for getting about in thick scrub Cons- Very poor ground coverage/short legs, uses a lot of energy, average feet, heat tolerance and stamina can suffer from excessive muscle and short face 22. Coonhound Pros- Nose, determination on a trail, bush smarts, stamina, good feet, good voice/bailer, fast and agile, wary/cautious and safe Cons- Reluctance to lug, stubbornness on a trail, annoyingly noisy 23. Foxhound Pros- Nose, bush smarts, good feet, stamina, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, annoyingly noisy 24. Shar pei Pros- Grip, agility, composure cons- Health, cagey/sneaky, prone to aggression 25. Huntaway Pros- Energy, stamina, enthusiasm, heat tolerance, intelligence and bush smarts, good feet, agility Cons- Reluctance to lug, small 26. English pointer Pros- Nose, stamina, enthusiasm, good feet Cons- Not as smart as german pointers, reluctance to lug 27. German Wirehaired pointer Pros- Nose, stamina, enthusiasm, feet, tough coat Cons- Prone to aggression/cagey, reluctance to lug 28. Fila Brasileiro Pros- Grip, strength, courage, nose, durability Cons- fairly slow, prone to aggression, average stamina, illegal 29. Dogue de bordeaux Pros- Grip, strength, courage, durability Cons- inconsistency, poor heat tolerance and stamina 30. Cane corso Pros- Grip, strength, durability, athletic for a mastiff Cons- inconsistency, prone to lacking nerve 31. Black mouth curr Pros- Nose, enthusiasm/energy, good feet, good bush smarts, stamina, speed, wary/safe, durable Cons- unreliable lugger 32. Weimeraner Pros- Stamina, speed, nose, agility Cons- Reluctance to lug, lacks durability 33. Jagd terrier Pros- Courage, enthusiasm, nose, determination, good feet, agility, durability (so small it just bounces off) Cons- Small, Poor ground coverage and speed compared to bigger breeds, hard headed and stubborn, aggressive 34. Rottweiler Pros- Strength, grip, ok nose, intelligent Cons- Pain tolerance, composure and determination not as good as other luggers, can be surly and hard headed 35. Boerboel Pros- Grip, courage, pain tolerance, power, composure Cons- inconsistency, slow, poor stamina 36. Boston terrier Pros- spirited, enthusiastic and quick Cons- basically everything else, very small 37. Whippet Pros- Speed, quickness, agility, prey drive, vision, docile and quiet Cons- small, very thin skinned, delicate, poor tolerance for temperatures/weather 38. Labrador Pros- Intelligent, enthusiastic, nose Cons- Reluctance to lug/soft bite 39. Old english sheep dog Pros- Enthusiasm, confidence, energy Cons- Stubborn, can be aggressive and surly, coat too long 40. English bulldog Pros- instinct to grip, courage, determined and composed, strong Cons- Health and athleticism, deformed bite, very poor stamina, very slow, very poor ground coverage, very poor heat tolerance 41. Fox terrier Pros- Nose, enthusiasm, prey drive, tenacity, quickness Cons- prone to aggression, small, poor ground coverage 42. Otterhound Pros- Nose, good feet, durable skin/coat, tolerant of weather, good in water/swamps, good stamina and energy, good voice/bailer Cons- Reluctance to lug, not very fast 43. Hungarian Viszla Pros- speed, stamina, agility, nose Cons- Reluctance to lug, poor durability and pain tolerance 44. Saluki Pros- Anaerobic stamina, speed, ground coverage, prey drive Cons- Very delicate, thin skin, soft and timid, weak bite 45. Jack russel terrier Pros- nose, enthusiasm, tenacity, prey drive Cons- very small, very poor ground coverage/speed compared to big dogs, surly and aggressive 46. Borzoi Pros- Speed, stamina, ground coverage, prey drive Cons- Delicate, soft and wary, weak bite 47. Ibizan Hound Pros- Speed, prey drive, stamina, ground coverage Cons- Delicate, soft, weak bite [/quote1333839393] KeyserSoze You are Vorax with a changed IP. Everybody can see it with some brain left. It is funny, you have been banned here for a few times, but you appear on the same day witha new IP and nobody notices it here. The thing with DNA cluster and with the Presa Canario being one of the oldest breeds you have already told on Carnivora and here: http://sunnyak.forenworld.at/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=871&p=10261&hilit=Vorax#p10261 acamper said: Vorax I can't recall but just out of curiousity aren't you on MD under a different name? I go there and see you catch a little shit at times. That's an interesting dog the American Alsatian, nice mix as well. Vorax said: Yup that's me ;) If you want the proof, post number 12 and 13 on this page: http://sunnyak.forenworld.at/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=871&p=9972&hilit=Vorax#p9972 [/quote1334106327] Well Andreas you shouldn't have hijacked my thread and before you mask your IP 78.46.50.101 you should know a little bit more about trojans and root kits. If your computer starts slowing down and you get a blue screen you might want format your hard drive and hope you backed it up. Matthew 10:34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."
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