[quote1327745326=Tonedog] It's not a real serious test of their combative ability, their combative ability is there (if it is) thanks to their heritage as big-game subjugation dogs, varying degrees of that combative capacity can be retained depending on breeding practices. [/quote1327745326] Tonedog,even though i am a certified city boy,i do understand and agree with your point. A mentor of mine down in Texas,who owns only serious protection dogs...has reminded me that the only thing he knows that can actually simulate a hypothetical pissed off drugged up 300 lbs. man breaking in your door.....is to test them on a hog. He says that when the dog is faced up against something that is actually trying to kill them....this is the only true [u]TEST[/u] of whether or not your dog will quit on you when the chips are down........however ,,,he also sates that you should [u]always test[/u] your personal dog in some available public protection trial....at least once....because it will be a [u]test[/u] in unfamiliar place against a unfamiliar human,and also the fact that you and your dog have to work as a single unit and your own abilities to handle the situation and control your dog should the need arise.You will be testing your bond as well. And i always say,remember that a personal protection's dog main purpose(for us) is to protect the person from harm----a serious personal protections dog's true worth....involves much,much, more than just testing his combat ability and/or fighting some guy with a baton...I see many people overlooking this fact,and think it's all about this sleeve biting and teaching a "proper" full bite/grip they see on video......example: if two young punks don't see my dog in the car,and tries to assault/snatch my GF's purse at a gas station.....I don't want my dog so caught up in combating/dispatching one punk(hog),that the other punk has time to still continue to assault & violently snatch her jewelry off and steal the car. Also,the purpose and worth of a serious PP companion type dog also lies in it's socialization and availability for use in a public setting ...having a sentry dog with a fierce disposition,that isn't safe in public and rarely having visitors...is a different type of dog.....a different function. [quote1327661628=Tonedog] For me the thing with bandogs and PP is you just have to check that they're willing to engage a human, keep them fit, and then trust their evolutionary adaptations for big game subjugation are still in tact for if a real situation goes down. [/quote1327661628] Absolutely,you do have to check them against a human ....but I also feel that it does make a difference where you check them ,in your backyard or familiar surroundings......or,say driving 5 hrs away to some neighboring state,staying in a hotel overnight,then walking out on a field with strangers and strange dogs then suddenly get charged at by two suited guys wearing football helmets....you will be able to see if your dog will be more inclined to protect you....rather than protect himself ....ie. quit. Now,if you have trained for this scenario?.then you will be there testing your training....but if you truly want to test your dogs raw Genetics/Breeding--and your breeding stock?......then you will be there testing the dog,every single dog........i've witnessed "working breeders" do exactly this to see what they had. I do(so i know what i am feeding) fully intend on getting my personal dog out there with someone with experience and testing my dog as mentioned above...but in in the meantime of that,i've most definitely tested against a man,as well as several other judged stability/temperment tests to know my personal protection dog can actually function in a crowded city enviornment without fear of my dog 'misfiring". Like i said,I'm a city guy Tonedog/Gun,so I'll admit that I don't know from experience,so my question is: If you have a dog that his dispatched some of the toughest boars,coyotes and wolves there is,but has never seen or faced an aggressive human(or even a passive human holding a knife)....does that automatically translate into a dog that will protect you and loved ones from a bad guy? , little t