[quote=o_dosa_neo]granted...but the present day tosa had been developed buy the 1920's...in that period there were an estimated 5000 tosa breeders in japan...you dont think some could have been persuaded ($) to cut loose some stock... come-on[/quote] And then those decendents of those 1920's dogs ended up in the hands of DVM John Swinford in 1969? :lol: Sure, I'll buy it.