Breeding questions
[quote=Presadam]Would you remove asymptomatic parents and siblings from a breeding program based on one puppy each, out of two different litters, having two unrelated health problems? (no other puppies known to have problems, no other relations known to have problems as yet)
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First I would have all other siblings tested to find or rule out health issues with them.
If none are found with them then it's obviously quite possible that each case might have been brought on by freak chance or environmental situations.
I think would only be wise to overly scrutinize the pups produced from any of these breedings though.
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Replies (8)
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Ok, I didn't know how to put this into a topic, so the all encompassing "breeding question" is what you get. I'm trying to figure out if I'm off the track here, or on it. We have had a topic come up recently in the presa world. A breeder bred his stud male twice to two different bitches. In one litter, a dog has come out having epilepsy (no causative factors found per the vet). In the other litter a dog has "severe arthritis" at age 2 (per the owner). Breeder agreed not to breed the two that produced the epilepsy together again, but has made plans to breed the female, and to breed a daughter of the stud. According to the breeder, all dogs have been hip screened via vet prior to breeding. So, the owner of the epilepsy dog, and the owner of the arthritic dog are upset, and feel that the female and the daughter of the stud, shouldn't be bred. That nothing related should be bred until "breeder finds out where the (2 known) health problems are coming from". Parents are asymptomatic, no other progeny reports problems, known grandparents are also asymptomatic. So my question is this... Would you remove asymptomatic parents and siblings from a breeding program based on one puppy each, out of two different litters, having two unrelated health problems? (no other puppies known to have problems, no other relations known to have problems as yet) Can't wait to see where this goes :?
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[quote=Presadam]Would you remove asymptomatic parents and siblings from a breeding program based on one puppy each, out of two different litters, having two unrelated health problems? (no other puppies known to have problems, no other relations known to have problems as yet) [/quote] First I would have all other siblings tested to find or rule out health issues with them. If none are found with them then it's obviously quite possible that each case might have been brought on by freak chance or environmental situations. I think would only be wise to overly scrutinize the pups produced from any of these breedings though.
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Some health problems are ressessive traits that may be "Hidden" undectiable by health screening, only to appear when breed to another "carrier".(We trust people don't breed dogs with know problems) I wound't use that male on other bitch from those lines. I wouldn't breed the siblings back to those lines, I wouldn't bredd this stud on his future prodegey. Another point to concider have any other litters from this stud resulted in genetic health ptoblems?
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[quote="Platz"] I wound't use that male on other bitch from those lines. I wouldn't breed the siblings back to those lines, I wouldn't bredd this stud on his future prodegey. Another point to concider have any other litters from this stud resulted in genetic health ptoblems?[/quote] i wouldent use the females too
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so let me get this straight.....A bitch drop's a litter of lets say 14 pups. Out of those pups ONE comes out with health problems.....Would you then? Because to me that sounds like the litter was healthy with only one bad pup out of it. Which there could be many reasons why a dog has these two health issues other then from the parents. Espechally if all dogs are tested and pass.
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would need time to find where the probleme comes from, if its the father problem then the mother is ok to breed but would need to do some tests fist, if its a small health problem is one thing, big health issues is another even when talking about 1 sick puppy
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The medical definition of epilepsy in dogs (defined as Idiopathic epilepsy) simply means "seizures from an unknown origin". Can you blame the breeder or say Really that it's anything to do with either dogs when siezures can come on from so many different factors. Arthritis also can be from more then a poor breeding pair. Could be from damage done earlier in life that only the owner or possibly just dog may have been involved with. Or quality of life can also factor in also what dog has been fed. Out of two litters only two pup's were found to be unhealthy? How many were born from those two litters? How many puppies out of the two bitches otherwise? Any other il-health traits that you know of? Another question what do you mean by being asymptomatic? Asymptomatic means there are no symptoms. So do they have something that is known but not causing any effects? Or do they have a clean bill of health?
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Asymptomatic meaning no one has apparently shown any symptoms of any problems. This case was not my breeding, it was someone else's, so my info is second hand, and based entirely on what each party has admitted to. Since I originally posted this, the dam has died from bloat. The owner and the breeder seemed to have arrived at a truce, adn the breeder reportedly promised the owner he would not breed those two again. But apparently he owner thought that meant at all, and the breeder meant to each other...so when mom was bred again, and a daughter from the sire was bred..the owner felt this was a broken promise, and went after the breeder again :roll: For my personal answer, it would be fine to breed each dog again, and eval puppies. Should either problem show up in either side again, I would remove them (parents and affected dogs) from breeding