LUNCHTIME

Eastern LGDs are known for being extremely self-sufficient and independent dogs. Shars not only guard their property and livestock without supervision for days, they also know instinctively, how to take care of their own needs when necessary. What I find remarkable is how they intuitively distinguish between animals that are considered livestock and those that are game. The same dog has made sure that not a single livestock animal was ever killed on her watch. Nobody ever taught her that.

Excellent photo. Although I'm not sure this quality is so dramatically unique. My neo x bandog was like this, killed and ate countless critters, but would quickly get the message if you told him to not attack chickens or cows or whatever, and wouldn't need telling twice.

Just spit balling here, but how could that dog catch a bunny? Bunnies are fast as hell, not saying that this dog isn't athletic or anything but just asking. I thought you needed lurchers/whippets/sight hounds to catch them because they are so fast. I know my dog is about 80 pounds and he disgustingly fast but there is no way he can catch up to a squirrel or a rabbit.

Well that picture is a pretty good evidence of your statement lol I guess in an open field it would be more difficult for those that weren't bred for speed.

Yeah in a fair chase in the open a big heavy dog won't catch a rabbit, they're not gonna be consistently running down rabbits, but circumstances can lead to it happening once in a while. Mind you, rabbits are nothing compared to jack rabbits and hares. You don't need a SUPER fast dog to catch them with some consistency. My late neo x shouldn't have been able to catch this (albeit mangy) fox, but he did- Didn't eat it though, luckily. Did eat this fella, and more like him. This photo is unusual because often all he left was clumps of fur and a neat little stomach pouch filled with vegetable matter.

[quote1331777115=Tonedog] killed and ate countless critters, but would quickly get the message if you told him to not attack chickens or cows or whatever, and wouldn't need telling twice. [/quote1331777115] Yeah, the thing is, that dog doesn't get the message - ever! If she decides that she wants to kill something, nothing can convince her otherwise. She does what SHE thinks is right; very difficult dog to own in that regard. Also, she spent the first 3 years or so in civilization, didn't get imprinted on a life with livestock (I would SOO like to showcase her to Coppinger, who believes that it's more or less all just right upbringing and imprinting). From day one in rural Montana, she totally got it. Sometimes she would "gobble" small ducklings or chicks down her mouth, so when I attempted to get em out, they were completely soaked but unharmed (physically, not sure about psychological damages). She "gets" the concept of livestock, she also gets that other animals don't belong there - other than as a source of protein.

[quote1331778200=davidfitness83] how could that dog catch a bunny? Bunnies are fast as hell, not saying that this dog isn't athletic or anything but just asking. [/quote1331778200] In short, that dog is crazy. What she wants she gets. Always. Somehow.

[quote1331778380=babigirl][br][link={e_FILE}public/1331733742_11706_FT86811_bunny_head.jpg][img:width=500&height=333]{e_FILE}public/1331733742_11706_FT86811_bunny_head_.jpg">[/link][br] [/quote1331778380] "Bryant Heating & Cooling Systems - Don't lose your head over high electricity bills!" LOL

[quote1331778811=Tonedog] Yeah in a fair chase in the open a big heavy dog won't catch a rabbit, they're not gonna be consistently running down rabbits, but circumstances can lead to it happening once in a while. Mind you, rabbits are nothing compared to jack rabbits and hares. You don't need a SUPER fast dog to catch them with some consistency. [/quote1331778811] Sure, in the end it's all just a statistics game (with every prey and predator really). Even if the rabbit has a 99% probability of getting away, for 1 in 100 chases this still translates into lunch. BTW, this was a Montana Jack Rabbit.

My boy catches Hare and Jack rabbit... Regular everyday cotton tail are hard though

I don't know about that, I use to raise beagles for rabbit hunting. The rabbits were fast but they don't have much endurance at that pace. They try to run in big circles and only run in bursts then wait. Once the dogs catch up they run again. I guess that's why the hare in the tortoise and the hare did. But beagles maintain a steady pace behind them and will eventually catch up. After a couple of circles bet on the rabbit being about 10 yards in front of the dogs. The rabbit is betting on getting out of sight and the dog loosing track of him, or circling back to a hole to hide in. If you don't put yourself in the path of that circle and shoot the rabbit or if the rabbit runs into a place you can't get to him the dogs will eventually run him down and have it half eaten before you can get there. So as long as the dog above can keep a beagles pace long enough, there is nothing for the rabbit to hide under, is persistent and has a good nose there is no reason to think he couldn't catch rabbits consistently. The advantage a beagle has is he's rabbit sized so he can follow the rabbit through brush and under briar patches. That's why beagles are bred with short legs so they can follow the rabbit anywhere and so they don't catch him too quickly. I think the reason poachers preffered sighthounds to scent hounds is a short, fast, quiet chase won't get them caught like a 20 minute chase by a pack of baying hounds.

@Astibus Working LGD's are raised with livestock. If these dogs weren't raised with livestock they would probably see the livestock as prey.

Gamebred, some of my LGDs weren't raised with livestock at all. Yet today they are guarding livestock like you wouldn't believe and still hunt down the occasional wild prey. The female in the picture falls into that category; she spent her first 3 years in suburban civilization, no training, no livestock, not even mountains. Then I moved to Montana and she picked it all up in no time. To tell you the truth, I had hoped they'd get at least to leave livestock alone and keep predators away. But these working LGDs do much more than that, they actively protect livestock from bodily harm. So no, they don't see the livestock as prey. At least mine don't.