Boerboel / Presa

Hmm wolfie, the good presa is maybe hard to find in the uk, but thats also where the very best ones are. Theres a lot of crap everywhere but if you want a real deal hardcore working presa, then the uk is the place to look. If anything, you may not qualify to get one of the real ones because it is really hard to obtain a presa from top working security folks in the uk without knowing them and having experience and other qualifications, but it can be done. Just ignore the "breeders" and look for security professionals. I dont know enough good breeders of boerboels to recommend anyone specific, but i do know that you have to be even more careful and thorough when looking for good boerboels than when looking for good presas. Be careful because many boerboels are 1st gen pit/oem crosses, scatterbred bullmastiff mutts and non working quality curs, so really try hard to get good with respectable working people that can put you in contact with someone who has real purebred working boerboels before falling for some pet/show breeder's fancy website. Good luck with whatever you choose.

I have heard good things about both these breeders... http://www.farmdogs.co.uk/ http://www.claymoreboerboel.com/claymore1_index.htm Good Luck

if i had to choose a boerboel, i would look for a breeder who doesn´t care about dog shows :!: i hope the bb will not be changed in temperament like we could see it with the dogue de bordeaux. i mean what gets judged in dog shows :?: not really impotant things. do they judge guarding instinct, braveness....no :!: all thing a good working boerbnoel should have. some people think these things make a dog dangerous, but for example the farmers in africa culled a dog that showed aggression towards kids or other family members. here some kennels that obviously test their dogs http://www.terraworld.net/dkhfarms/index2.htm http://www.topguardkennels.co.uk/ http://www.boerboels.com/English/working_boerboel.htm maybe you let us now which breeder was the breeder of your choice

I have got also Boerboels and I love them.. see my website.... and I cant tell you much about the Presa... Sorry Good luck with your search.

there are some excellent workin types of presa at uk.try to search for raptors kennel.they have only working dogs!!

borboel dog introducing to working world,don't know how to act,out of his enviroment http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVcCiGthExw presa canario introducing to working world,out of his enviroment also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ujd0JcMTvdQ

[quote=elnegro]borboel dog introducing to working world,don't know how to act,out of his enviroment http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVcCiGthExw presa canario introducing to working world,out of his enviroment also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ujd0JcMTvdQ[/quote] i don´t think we can generalize it like that. you will also find beorboels that act confident and also presas that are not convident. it should depend on the lines and the breeding and individual :!:

if you try to compare borboel vs presa canario,you will see what i mean!!Presa Canario is a very tuff dog maybe the tuffest breed,sometimes really dangerous because he is very dominate.Most of dogmen believes that the true Presa Canario is the best self-defence breed in the world! That's my opinion of course! :wink:

[quote=elnegro]if you try to compare borboel vs presa canario,you will see what i mean!!Presa Canario is a very tuff dog maybe the tuffest breed,sometimes really dangerous because he is very dominate.Most of dogmen believes that the true Presa Canario is the best self-defence breed in the world! That's my opinion of course! :wink:[/quote] no doubt i believe you that presa are tough dogs, but there are many tough dogs. there are tough LGDs which fight wild predators, there are tough large game hunters which hunt dangerous game.... you said if i try to compare boerboel vs presa i will see what you mean, so in which szenario shall i compare them, because there are different tasks where a dog can show how tough it is. shall i only compare their ability as personal protection dog or also their ability to fight another dog that is a good fighter (dog on dog combat) and their ability to fight an wild predator. so to really compare them i would need to have material in all three different tasks of both of them. i have videos of both of them when it comes to the firts two mentioned things, but we should do that on pm. so maybe we can exchange some stuff. :wink:

if you am after a presa join elpresa. best uk breeders am j7 irema curto. winjim as the red star dogs he as a very nice dog called troy

some pic of winjims and j7s[br][link={e_FILE}public/1262973396_18019_FT46319_rs_jos_120.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1262973396_18019_FT46319_rs_jos_120_.jpg">[/link][br][br][link={e_FILE}public/1262973396_18019_FT46319_rs_trix_125.jpg][img:width=500&height=375]{e_FILE}public/1262973396_18019_FT46319_rs_trix_125_.jpg">[/link][br][br][img:width=200&height=171]{e_FILE}public/1262973396_18019_FT46319_dsc_3061.jpg">[br][img:width=162&height=200]{e_FILE}public/1262973396_18019_FT46319_dsc_3103.jpg">

i had presas, they are great dogs. but ive been doing a lot of research on guard dogs and my favourites are: caucasian shepard boerboel central asian shepard and the kangal dog. to be fair i think although presas are lovely dogs, they are a bit stupid. mine used to see birds as threats and would quite happily bark at them all day long.

[quote1262998507=ant2010] to be fair i think although presas are lovely dogs, they are a bit stupid. mine used to see birds as threats and would quite happily bark at them all day long. [/quote1262998507] Ive never heard such a BS comment in all my life. Maybe your Presa is stupid, but for you to generalize about a whole breed based on an obviously poor selected dog is just spewing garbage. My Presa is as sharp as his teeth, and I have never owned a smarter breed. He learns faster than many Malinois...and that came from the mouth of someone who trains them for the Costa Rican Military. The basics below were taught all in one day and were retained thereafter. Maybe its just you who cannot teach, because I know the Presa will learn. [youtube=425,344]79jkbPvAjsw[/youtube]

I must say that I know a few people who own some examples of dogs of both breeds in the UK, though because of the care for each breed, the best are selectively bred and selectively distributed within the populous. There is some awesome old school Curto blood in the UK that is hard to attain anywhere else, as well as some impressive examples of the Boerbeol as well. IMO, it would come down to size and personal preference if both were obtainable...

[quote1263027369=MickWrath] [quote1262998507=ant2010] to be fair i think although presas are lovely dogs, they are a bit stupid. mine used to see birds as threats and would quite happily bark at them all day long. [/quote1262998507] Ive never heard such a BS comment in all my life. Maybe your Presa is stupid, but for you to generalize about a whole breed based on an obviously poor selected dog is just spewing garbage. My Presa is as sharp as his teeth, and I have never owned a smarter breed. He learns faster than many Malinois...and that came from the mouth of someone who trains them for the Costa Rican Military. The basics below were taught all in one day and were retained thereafter. Maybe its just you who cannot teach, because I know the Presa will learn. [youtube=425,344]79jkbPvAjsw[/youtube] [/quote1263027369] why be funny mate and say stupid? at the end of the day i gave my opinion which everyone has their right to, at the end of the day your dog doesnt even look like a pure presa,and whats wrong with his eye? j7 who is a uk breeder has the best irema curto presas in the uk, and winjim has 3 red star dogs. do some research on dogs, im just stating a fact the best guard dog is a caucasian ovcharka. im not putting presas down they are fantastic dogs natural guarding instinct is ok. caucasian ovcharkas natural instinct? excellent.

[quote1263033234=MickWrath] [quote1262998507=ant2010] to be fair i think although presas are lovely dogs, they are a bit stupid. mine used to see birds as threats and would quite happily bark at them all day long. [/quote1262998507] Ive never heard such a BS comment in all my life. Maybe your Presa is stupid, but for you to generalize about a whole breed based on an obviously poor selected dog is just spewing garbage. My Presa is as sharp as his teeth, and I have never owned a smarter breed. He learns faster than many Malinois...and that came from the mouth of someone who trains them for the Costa Rican Military. The basics below were taught all in one day and were retained thereafter. Maybe its just you who cannot teach, because I know the Presa will learn. [youtube=425,344]79jkbPvAjsw[/youtube] [/quote1263033234] heres a video from the elpresa, dont get me wrong presa canarios a nice looking dog but nothing beats a shepard dog for training.watch the video straight through http://www.vimeo.com/843833[link=hyperlink url][/link]

I wasnt knockin J7 or his dogs, I know of them well, I simply said your comment about Presa's is BS. They are far from stupid and for you to say so is an insult and irresponsable. Maybe you should be more selective and pick from a litter with more easily trained parents. There is nothing wrong with his eye, he has a pigmented spot on his inner lid.

You can see the spot better in this picture.[br][link={e_FILE}public/1263059025_17884_FT46319_img_0022.jpg][img:width=500&height=281]{e_FILE}public/1263059025_17884_FT46319_img_0022_.jpg">[/link][br]

[blockquote]they are a bit stupid. mine used to see birds as threats and would quite happily bark at them all day long. [/blockquote] WOW! i sure would love to know what breed you got yours from.. coz i have never known a presa to be "Stupid" nor see birds as a threat and the need to bark at em all day long.. seen them kill birds, but not bark! the going after any animal big or small is a good sign of "Prey Drive"... So please tell who you got this supposed presa from.. P.s, i agree with MickWrath, that its an insult.. tho he says he is not knocking you.. i however, AM!

dont talk so F*****IN stupid. so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog, thats what i was stating. they dont have a NATURAL guarding instinct such as a caucasian shepard and that is a fact. thats the trouble with you americans, think you know it all, you just f****N idiots. have you been watching the uk big brother? with that plonker stephen baldwin? what a great example of an american? i dont think so what a twat. i know what a good presa is, the uk actually have some of the best lines. most presa kennels in america are crosses. what example would you give me of a good presa breeding kennel? let me guess sanders kennels? what a joke, they breed mutts. but dont get me wrong some do look nice, but i can bet those nice dogs are just purely accidental. that video is a very weak example of a presa. its head looks nothing like a presa. theres a few people on this forum who are puppy millers, and dog killers and they know who they are!

thought i would put up the info on both the presa and the caucasian ovcharka. i hate people when they dont listen. i LOVE presa canario, they are fantastic dogs, but you will always get bad in some no matter what bloodline, my male must have been bad. very dog aggressive, would bark now and agian at strangers but as soon as you let him out, he was basically just playuful. i will just state a fact all i wanted was a guard dog not an attack dog. theres no point me having a presa canario and learn it to attack on the arm like all the vids on youtube when i dont do security work or the like. i am not putting presas down, they are good guard dogs in their own way. but i stated i wanted a good guard dog for the home. which the cauacasian shepherd is supposed to be the best. read the temprements on both dogs

ran out of room here are the links: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perro_de_Presa_Canario[link=hyperlink url][/link] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_Shepherd_Dog[link=hyperlink url][/link] and by the way didnt mean to offend all americans, only some are stupid!!

You insulted members of this board, their dogs, called Americans idiots, and you are new here. You have no clue about Presa's or CO's. You read a little on the internet and think you know of these dogs. Your ignorance is shining through, and maybe if you actually had experience with these dogs you might learn something. You know what? get that CO...I cant wait to see someone who can't train their Presa to not bark at birds, try and keep an Ovtcharka in line. You're in for a suprise. Look at the picture "mate" His head is off? Because it is a cubic brachycephalic with a spot on 6:4 skull/face ratio? Because he has a small white blaze that is allthough rare, still allowed by breed standard? Because his skull is convex in anteposterior & transversal direction? Because his nose, and lips are pigmented? Or maybe because his mask and flews are correct? Because his zygomatic arches are defined? Or what about his scissor bite? Go run and look up some definitions so you can understand those big words "mate."

[quote1263148026=MickWrath] You insulted members of this board, their dogs, called Americans idiots, and you are new here. You have no clue about Presa's or CO's. You read a little on the internet and think you know of these dogs. Your ignorance is shining through, and maybe if you actually had experience with these dogs you might learn something. You know what? get that CO...I cant wait to see someone who can't train their Presa to not bark at birds, try and keep an Ovtcharka in line. You're in for a suprise. Look at the picture "mate" His head is off? Because it is a cubic brachycephalic with a spot on 6:4 skull/face ratio? Because he has a small white blaze that is allthough rare, still allowed by breed standard? Because his skull is convex in anteposterior & transversal direction? Because his nose, and lips are pigmented? Or maybe because his mask and flews are correct? Because his zygomatic arches are defined? Or what about his scissor bite? Go run and look up some definitions so you can understand those big words "mate." [/quote1263148026] can you tell me what breeder this dog is from?

[quote1263148066=troy] the guy ask for an advice.not opinioin about what breed breed you like the most. mr ant. want to discuss presa/dogo start a new tread. there are more kwnoledgable people here than you can imagine. try to blend in pal. you just join the site like 5 days ago and you actualy think you are the the new kid in town.give me a break. [/quote1263148066] not calling myself an expert, just gave my opinion, which i thought i was entitled to. i wasnt the first one to insult on here, so thats got that straight. what do you expect me to do when someone insults me? just let it pass, and let others join in too? i dont think so. i gave my opinion and thats it.

[quote1263196552=ant2010] dont talk so F*****IN stupid. so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog, thats what i was stating. they dont have a NATURAL guarding instinct such as a caucasian shepard and that is a fact. thats the trouble with you americans, think you know it all, you just f****N idiots. have you been watching the uk big brother? with that plonker stephen baldwin? what a great example of an american? i dont think so what a twat. i know what a good presa is, the uk actually have some of the best lines. most presa kennels in america are crosses. what example would you give me of a good presa breeding kennel? let me guess sanders kennels? what a joke, they breed mutts. but dont get me wrong some do look nice, but i can bet those nice dogs are just purely accidental. that video is a very weak example of a presa. its head looks nothing like a presa. theres a few people on this forum who are puppy millers, and dog killers and they know who they are! [/quote1263196552] lol what a damn fool you are! my presa has not had 1 second of training and is pretty damn protective especially of my fiancee.. i also remember my dog been taken away from me for 10 days on a rabies watch after he took down a trespasser at the age of 6 months old.. he is protective of me but very protective of my Fiancee and children and has outstanding prey drive when it comes to over animals..

[quote1263202177=Drazhar] [quote1263196552=ant2010] dont talk so F*****IN stupid. so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog, thats what i was stating. they dont have a NATURAL guarding instinct such as a caucasian shepard and that is a fact. thats the trouble with you americans, think you know it all, you just f****N idiots. have you been watching the uk big brother? with that plonker stephen baldwin? what a great example of an american? i dont think so what a twat. i know what a good presa is, the uk actually have some of the best lines. most presa kennels in america are crosses. what example would you give me of a good presa breeding kennel? let me guess sanders kennels? what a joke, they breed mutts. but dont get me wrong some do look nice, but i can bet those nice dogs are just purely accidental. that video is a very weak example of a presa. its head looks nothing like a presa. theres a few people on this forum who are puppy millers, and dog killers and they know who they are! [/quote1263196552] lol what a damn fool you are! my presa has not had 1 second of training and is pretty damn protective especially of my fiancee.. i also remember my dog been taken away from me for 10 days on a rabies watch after he took down a trespasser at the age of 6 months old.. he is protective of me but very protective of my Fiancee and children and has outstanding prey drive when it comes to over animals.. [/quote1263202177] my presa was exactly the same, very good always protective on the lead and with my children. i was just stating that the caucasian ovcharka, had a better natural guarding instinct. start reading the posts better then replying

[quote1263273605=ant2010] [quote1263202177=Drazhar] [quote1263196552=ant2010] dont talk so F*****IN stupid. so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog, thats what i was stating. they dont have a NATURAL guarding instinct such as a caucasian shepard and that is a fact. thats the trouble with you americans, think you know it all, you just f****N idiots. have you been watching the uk big brother? with that plonker stephen baldwin? what a great example of an american? i dont think so what a twat. i know what a good presa is, the uk actually have some of the best lines. most presa kennels in america are crosses. what example would you give me of a good presa breeding kennel? let me guess sanders kennels? what a joke, they breed mutts. but dont get me wrong some do look nice, but i can bet those nice dogs are just purely accidental. that video is a very weak example of a presa. its head looks nothing like a presa. theres a few people on this forum who are puppy millers, and dog killers and they know who they are! [/quote1263196552] lol what a damn fool you are! my presa has not had 1 second of training and is pretty damn protective especially of my fiancee.. i also remember my dog been taken away from me for 10 days on a rabies watch after he took down a trespasser at the age of 6 months old.. he is protective of me but very protective of my Fiancee and children and has outstanding prey drive when it comes to over animals.. [/quote1263202177] my presa was exactly the same, very good always protective on the lead and with my children. i was just stating that the caucasian ovcharka, had a better natural guarding instinct. start reading the posts better then replying [/quote1263273605] i read exactly what you said! [blockquote] so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog[/blockquote] number 1 i never said it was the BEST natural guardian, number 2.. you contradicted your self by saying that they have to be trained to be a guard dog, then saying yours was protective without training.. and oh.. my dog is protective on and off the leash.. no one was even home when he took that guy down for trespassing.. he was protecting his land. just do 1 of 2 things, admit your clueless and never owned a presa so have no idea what your talking about, or number 2! just keep silent.. dont say anything else and just Move on..

[quote1263290273=Drazhar] [quote1263273605=ant2010] [quote1263202177=Drazhar] [quote1263196552=ant2010] dont talk so F*****IN stupid. so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog, thats what i was stating. they dont have a NATURAL guarding instinct such as a caucasian shepard and that is a fact. thats the trouble with you americans, think you know it all, you just f****N idiots. have you been watching the uk big brother? with that plonker stephen baldwin? what a great example of an american? i dont think so what a twat. i know what a good presa is, the uk actually have some of the best lines. most presa kennels in america are crosses. what example would you give me of a good presa breeding kennel? let me guess sanders kennels? what a joke, they breed mutts. but dont get me wrong some do look nice, but i can bet those nice dogs are just purely accidental. that video is a very weak example of a presa. its head looks nothing like a presa. theres a few people on this forum who are puppy millers, and dog killers and they know who they are! [/quote1263196552] lol what a damn fool you are! my presa has not had 1 second of training and is pretty damn protective especially of my fiancee.. i also remember my dog been taken away from me for 10 days on a rabies watch after he took down a trespasser at the age of 6 months old.. he is protective of me but very protective of my Fiancee and children and has outstanding prey drive when it comes to over animals.. [/quote1263202177] my presa was exactly the same, very good always protective on the lead and with my children. i was just stating that the caucasian ovcharka, had a better natural guarding instinct. start reading the posts better then replying [/quote1263273605] i read exactly what you said! [blockquote] so youm tellimg me that a presa is the best guarding dog? i dont think so, they have to be trained to be a guard dog[/blockquote] number 1 i never said it was the BEST natural guardian, number 2.. you contradicted your self by saying that they have to be trained to be a guard dog, then saying yours was protective without training.. and oh.. my dog is protective on and off the leash.. no one was even home when he took that guy down for trespassing.. he was protecting his land. just do 1 of 2 things, admit your clueless and never owned a presa so have no idea what your talking about, or number 2! just keep silent.. dont say anything else and just Move on.. [/quote1263290273] you're the type of person that makes these forums bad. you give your opinion on everything, but dont listen to what others have to say. you're the childish one to keep replying and trying to escalate things into an arguement. you're going to be the one who has their dog put down for being stupid with it. you're the one who will give the presa a bad name. what a joke you are. i am responsible with my animals, not someone who finds it great that my dog would attack a person. do you realise that if he had managed to kill the bloke the dog would have been destroyed and you would have been going to jail. lol. and you say you know your dogs.

[blockquote]you're the type of person that makes these forums bad. you give your opinion on everything, but dont listen to what others have to say. you're the childish one to keep replying and trying to escalate things into an arguement. you're going to be the one who has their dog put down for being stupid with it. you're the one who will give the presa a bad name. what a joke you are. i am responsible with my animals, not someone who finds it great that my dog would attack a person. do you realise that if he had managed to kill the bloke the dog would have been destroyed and you would have been going to jail. lol. and you say you know your dogs.[/blockquote] lol not where i live mate.. even the cops said the dog done great, he don't attack unless its justified, ill not give Presa a bad name you damn fool, unless him biting someone that break in to his property is wrong.. if its wrong where you live then you have no business having one, i seriously doubt you have ever had one or seen one in real life. you are clueless! and im not making the forum bad, I unlike YOU! gave better advice on the behavior of a Presa canario as i have one and i have been around lots and have many friends in the Presa world.. i speak to many of them on a daily basis. you think i will give them a bad name!? go to any Presa Canario breeder (Not Dogo Canario) and tell them Presa's are stupid and sit around barking at birds all day, Then tell them i say the opposite and have them give you their Opinion. Be warned, they don't like foolish kids, so don't hold your breath for any help from them.

[quote1263404580=Drazhar] [blockquote]you're the type of person that makes these forums bad. you give your opinion on everything, but dont listen to what others have to say. you're the childish one to keep replying and trying to escalate things into an arguement. you're going to be the one who has their dog put down for being stupid with it. you're the one who will give the presa a bad name. what a joke you are. i am responsible with my animals, not someone who finds it great that my dog would attack a person. do you realise that if he had managed to kill the bloke the dog would have been destroyed and you would have been going to jail. lol. and you say you know your dogs.[/blockquote] lol not where i live mate.. even the cops said the dog done great, he don't attack unless its justified, ill not give Presa a bad name you damn fool, unless him biting someone that break in to his property is wrong.. if its wrong where you live then you have no business having one, i seriously doubt you have ever had one or seen one in real life. you are clueless! and im not making the forum bad, I unlike YOU! gave better advice on the behavior of a Presa canario as i have one and i have been around lots and have many friends in the Presa world.. i speak to many of them on a daily basis. you think i will give them a bad name!? go to any Presa Canario breeder (Not Dogo Canario) and tell them Presa's are stupid and sit around barking at birds all day, Then tell them i say the opposite and have them give you their Opinion. Be warned, they don't like foolish kids, so don't hold your breath for any help from them. [/quote1263404580] what an idiot. why do you keep going on about viciousness in your dog? any vicious dog is a dangerous dog. i have my animals as pets, to be loved, not to earn their keep, and to amuse you. the sole purpose of having a pet is to love it and care for it. not be a dickhead like you with it. you're probably the type of guy to sit on the streets with a beer and brag about your dog barking at everyone. i have had presas ive had both male and female in the past. if i wanted another presa i could buy myself 2 tomorrow. but after doing research i decided to have a change. youre telling me breeders dont like talking to kids, well how do you get on then when you act like a teenager. do what you want with your dog, go and shag it for all i care. im not bothered at the end of the day my animals are loved not being made to be vicious.

[quote1263615455=ant2010] [quote1263404580=Drazhar] [blockquote]you're the type of person that makes these forums bad. you give your opinion on everything, but dont listen to what others have to say. you're the childish one to keep replying and trying to escalate things into an arguement. you're going to be the one who has their dog put down for being stupid with it. you're the one who will give the presa a bad name. what a joke you are. i am responsible with my animals, not someone who finds it great that my dog would attack a person. do you realise that if he had managed to kill the bloke the dog would have been destroyed and you would have been going to jail. lol. and you say you know your dogs.[/blockquote] lol not where i live mate.. even the cops said the dog done great, he don't attack unless its justified, ill not give Presa a bad name you damn fool, unless him biting someone that break in to his property is wrong.. if its wrong where you live then you have no business having one, i seriously doubt you have ever had one or seen one in real life. you are clueless! and im not making the forum bad, I unlike YOU! gave better advice on the behavior of a Presa canario as i have one and i have been around lots and have many friends in the Presa world.. i speak to many of them on a daily basis. you think i will give them a bad name!? go to any Presa Canario breeder (Not Dogo Canario) and tell them Presa's are stupid and sit around barking at birds all day, Then tell them i say the opposite and have them give you their Opinion. Be warned, they don't like foolish kids, so don't hold your breath for any help from them. [/quote1263404580] what an idiot. why do you keep going on about viciousness in your dog? any vicious dog is a dangerous dog. i have my animals as pets, to be loved, not to earn their keep, and to amuse you. the sole purpose of having a pet is to love it and care for it. not be a dickhead like you with it. you're probably the type of guy to sit on the streets with a beer and brag about your dog barking at everyone. i have had presas ive had both male and female in the past. if i wanted another presa i could buy myself 2 tomorrow. but after doing research i decided to have a change. youre telling me breeders dont like talking to kids, well how do you get on then when you act like a teenager. do what you want with your dog, go and shag it for all i care. im not bothered at the end of the day my animals are loved not being made to be vicious. [/quote1263615455] wow, you are a Tard.. i dont sit in the streets and i very very rarely drink a beer at all.. i dont brag about my dog barking at people, but the idea of a Presa and any guard dog is to be loving to the family and friends and guard you and your home from intruders/robbers/rapists/murderers ect ect... me saying my dog done a good job for taking down a trespasser is in no shape or form putting a kid image on me.. you sir are an idiot.. ok? and idiot... my dog lives like a king, he is very very loved by family and friends, even sleeps in bed with us, he is a utter lovable baby but turns on like a light switch when needed! understand? now shhhhhh.

I have had the same question as the the first one as what are the different qualities in both dogs, I have been researching the breeds for a couple of years but have yet met either one in person so I have not been able to make up my mind as to which one suits my needs best, I need a dog that will guard my family i have no doubt either one will do that but I also need one as a family companion that responds well to training I have had dominate dogs in the the past but I am looking at something new and that hasn't been ruined buy people just trying to make money or watered down so it can be a show dog

[html] i haven't read the whole thread (i stopped reading when people started to fight), so i apologize in advance if this question already has been answered earlier. what i would like to know about the presa and the boerboel is, if they do need any training at all in order to protect any area as they should or is this ability present in both breeds (and here i mean properly bred dogs, not show lines or dogs from backyard breeders)? i ask since i have heard both - there are some that say that those breeds guard without training, others say that you not only have to select fitting individuals but that you also have to train them so that they will master the task of guarding an area. [/html]

You could argue both, because in order to maintain a population of inherently protective dogs, you need to test, train and select for them. The moment you cease, the trait may disappear. There is no such thing as a population of dogs that are 100% able to perform this or any trait. All breeds have their "culls" it just depends if they are or not.

[html] ok, that far i do agree. but let me put it this way. i would like to purchase a presa or boerboel and the breeder i have chosen has trained and evaluated the parents of the litter for guarding. they do guard well. but how high is the risk that the pups guard poorly or won't guard at all without training? is it possible to say or does this vary strongly within the breeds? [/html]

It should not vary much within either breed. Both breeds should exhibit natural guardian traits and defense. Some report quite enthusiastically, I might add. Different stock will have different levels of human or animal/dog reactiveness, or combinations of the two. As in most guardian breeds, with an increase in show popularity, the temperament will "soften" in the show world, potentially making a greater variance in the breeds temperament.

[html] thanks. do you know any unspoiled breeding lines for boerboel or presa regarding guarding without being (too) dog aggressive? or where can i find more information? [/html]